JD Vance Makes Light of Actual Foreign Interference in His State
At a press conference on Ohio’s efforts to respond to the chaos created in Springfield by a slew of bomb threats, Governor Mike DeWine revealed that a number of the bomb threats came from “one particular country” overseas.
We have people, unfortunately, overseas, who are taking these actions. Some of them are coming from one particular country. We think that this is one more opportunity to mess with the United States. And they’re continuing to do that.
After that, in a truly deranged Xitter manifesto basically arguing that if the media doesn’t platform the false claims of Nazis attacking migrants, they’ll shoot someone, JD Vance falsely claimed that that’s proof a double standard from the media, then continued to lie that Kamala Harris was responsible for the assassination attempts against Trump.
[R]eports today suggest they came from a foreign country, not–as the media suggested–a deranged Trump fan.
The double standard is breathtaking. Donald Trump and I are, by their account, directly responsible for bomb threats from foreign countries. Why? Because we had the audacity to repeat what residents told us about the problems in their town. Meanwhile, Harris allies call for Trump to be eliminated as the media publishes arguments that he deserved to be shot.
Vance integrated this attack into his stump speech in Sparta Michigan, claiming that, “the American media has been laundering foreign disinformation” and deliberately lying — before DeWine revealed this — when they noted the bomb threats followed Trump and JD’s false attacks on Haitians.
Bomb threats that shut down schools and police stations and city halls is not foreign disinformation, JD. They are threats, just like the threats Trump has elicited against prosecutors, judges, and witnesses in cases against him. Everyone has had to take those bomb threats seriously, because you never know when one will be real. A school principal can’t tell in real time if a threat is coming from overseas. The threats have caused real costs to the city and its residents.
And, even if all the threats are coming from overseas — which goes further than what DeWine said — they are a foreign attack on Springfield. A foreign attack on Springfield doing very real damage.
I find it curious that DeWine didn’t reveal which country — China, Iran, Russia are the likely candidates given DeWine’s description that the country is taking “one more opportunity to mess with the United States” — is calling in these bomb threats. A Trump supporter like DeWine would have incentive to reveal if it were either of the first two (China doesn’t do this kind of thing, but Iran adopted the identity of Proud Boys in 2020 to threaten Democratic voters). If it’s Russia — and even if it’s Iran — the foreign country would be doing the bomb threats for the same reason Trump and JD keep lying about Haitians: to stoke fear and division. If it’s Russia, they’d be doing so in support of the candidate selling fear and division. But whichever it is, it appears to be (given DeWine’s description), a hostile foreign country seeking to harm the United States.
And the Senator from Ohio, JD Vance, treats these attacks on his state with very real consequences as mere disinformation.
The Senator from Ohio is minimizing an attack from one foreign country so he can attack immigrants legally in his state. JD Vance is awfully selective about which foreign threats he wails about.
Update: Relatedly, yesterday The New Republic published my analogy between JD’s false claims and those made by trolls pushing Trump in 2016.
Bob Mueller might be selling a book, but it doesn’t mean he’s wrong. And whether the issue is interference from Russia or elsewhere, including domestic disinformation campaigns on an unprecedented scale, the US and especially its media, seem unprepared. But the Guardian’s Martin Pengelly gives us a melange without much analysis, and still uses “collusion” when he should say “conspiracy.”
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2024/sep/18/russia-election-interference-robert-mueller
There’s a big difference between threats originating from a foreign country, and threats being coordinated by the government of a foreign country. DeWine’s speculation doesn’t exclude one or the other.
Also, speaking as a tech guy, I have to ask if the threats are actually originating in a foreign country at all, or are Americans using VOIP services to make calls that seem to originate from a foreign country, in order to get a little bit of insulation?
Because that’s how the spam and scam calls that our government is useless to do anything about proliferate – there’s a foreign country in the chain and that stops tracking cold.
That is a very good point.
Also lost in the fray is that, over the past two weeks, there have been a ton of threats called in to schools all across the Midwest (including Ohio) and South, presumably copycat actions related to the recent Georgia school shooting tragedy.
I’d like to know where DeWine got his information, because I don’t think we can discount his incentives to lie.
Placing the blame on foreign actors takes the heat off Vance and Trump as instigators. They can disavow that their lies are endangering people because, after all, who can control foreign actors?
And if DeWine is squeamish about lying, not coming out and accusing a specific country would let him rationalize it to himself.
So the calls looked like they were local, but someone (presumably the FBI or some intelligence folks) told DeWine they were actually, mostly, coming from offshore. It’s not clear to me what the advantage would be for domestic callers to spoof that they were international AND YET make the calls look like they were local? I don’t get it.
And even if they’re from state sponsored actors, they still wouldn’t be happening if Vance and Trump hadn’t lied about this to bring the town to attention on the national stage.
Vance can’t avoid responsibility just because he allows foreign governments to take advantage of him. In fact, that’s exactly the sort of thing a presidential candidate (and seriously, he is, Trump isn’t going to make it 4 years. I have my doubts about 4 months) should avoid.
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“Anyone who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities.”
– Voltaire
JD Vance said: The double standard is breathtaking. Donald Trump and I are, by their account, directly responsible for bomb threats from foreign countries. Why? Because we had the audacity to repeat what residents told us about the problems in their town.
No, JD. That is not the reason that you and Donald Trump are responsible for the bomb threats. The reason you and Trump are responsible is because the two of you repeatedly knowingly lied about Haitian immigrants eating peoples’ pets. It is a deliberate attempt to stoke outrage at immigrants and create division for political purposes. Without the chaos and anger you and Trump pushed into the media spotlight, noone, foreign or domestic, would be calling in bomb threats in Springfield.
It’s all very sick. Sociopathic, really.
Yesterday, Harris interviewed with National Association of Black Journalists. e.g., https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j-JFg-LFH8s At that time Trump was pumping crypto and Vance was still on pet eating. The media, since the switch. has been whining “She won’t give interviews,” and when she did, but not with them on Sundays, they let the other side suck media attention by Trump and Vance blowing smoke. Horserace coverage, neck and neck, they’re on the home stretch . . .
Maybe Mark Green can take time off from his divorce scandal to haul DeWine before the House Homeland Security Committee to demand that he reveal which foreign country is terrorizing America’s school children.
Mike DeWine can just call up Gang of 8 member Rep. Mike Turner and ask him to release the information.
J.D. Vance, proves, once again, that he is easily manipulated by the likes of Trump, Stephen Miller, Elon Musk, Peter Thiel, Bill Ackman and the rest of the Trump goons hypnotized by Putin and his oligarchs, Roman Abramovich and Semion Mogilevich, along with their puppet in Hungary, Viktor Orban.
Vance spends countless hours spewing their authoritarian BS policy and geopolitical beliefs while scrubbing his own past comments from the public that he made during his college days in a blatant ham-handed attempt to sculpt his previous policy and geopolitical beliefs from the public record.
Vance is a disgrace. I hope Walz hands him his arse during their joint public media event later this month.
I do, too.
But it might be valuable to Walz to learn of this guy’s perspective — he debated Vance; went into it believing he could annihilate the guy, and left defeated, having learned that Vance does have some debate skills:
https://www.thenation.com/article/politics/vance-weird-rural-populist/
But, yeah, these bastards are fascist to the core, and must be resoundingly defeated.
I have read more than once that Vance is intelligent. There is a distinct difference between intelligence and sly connivance.
Yes, there are several forms of intelligence. Kris Kobach, for example, is a high intellectual achiever, but he has few street smarts.
That said, “sly connivance,” might be JD’s way of approaching how to get what he wants. But intelligence relates to the intellectual resources he can bring to bear to implement it.
Reply to earlofhuntingdon
September 18, 2024 at 9:37 pm
“Kris Kobach, for example, is a high intellectual achiever…”
And I’m Batman.
Oh, I agree wholeheartedly about being prepared and knowing the opponent.
Like Trump, Vance has become a professional liar. And both Trump and Vance are liars like the late Charlie Manson. It’s impossible to carry on a discussion with a sociopathic liar.
This joint appearance on October 1 won’t be a debate; it is designed to make money for CBS.
Walz must destroy Vance like Harris destroyed Trump.
Thanks for linking to your really important “analogy between JD’s false claims
and those made by trolls pushing Trump in 2016” in TNR Marcy! I appreciate that
you linked to it on Bluesky, yesterday, too.
For those who haven’t read it yet, here’s the last paragraph:
Great article. Let’s hope it gets some traction with at least a few reporters, and they will go and sin (horserace) no more.
Senator Vance must have taken lessons on how to serve his constituents from Sen. “Cancun Ted” Cruz.
The Harvard-educated author of “Hillbilly Elegy” can’t think of better ways to direct media attention to the plight of Small Town, USA than peddling a rumor and then ignoring the harm to the community? Or investigating the possibility of foreign influence?
Vance and Cruz, amongst others in THE PARTY, are examples of how Harvard has lost its way as an educational institution of supreme standing.
Substituting high grades for coherent and ethical thinking does not make for upstanding leaders on any level, local, state, or national.
Graduating from Harvard is no guarantee of any kind of excellence without
the graduate being honest, as well. That goes for any institution of high learning. I’m fed up with this kind of credentialing, as suggesting a level of superiority just “because”………..
Let us not forget that our greatest President, Abraham Lincoln was self-taught and did not attend college. He was also a successful lawyer. He should have set the gold standard for qualifying for President, but “optics” and P.R. took the place of vetting based on values which match the goals of our Constitution.
JD “no periods please” Vance attended “the” Ohio State University and Yale.
I was mislead by a comment that he did attend Harvard at some point, but, let us not forget, Yale shouldn’t be left off the hook for producing some “challenged” political figures, and from their law school, no less!
Frankly, he doesn’t talk as a well-educated person would. Certainly, making up nasty stories about innocent people is something a malfunctioning teenager would do.
Reply to Magbeth
September 18, 2024 at 3:37 pm
While I agree that an Ivy League education is overrated, generalizations are silly.
JD Vance employs the same modification of speech patterns he derides Kamala Harris of using, varying them by audience. It’s natural, but damnable, when a Democrat does it.
George W. Bush was famous for it. Shrub did not use his local yokel Texican rancher-speak at Phillips Andover, Yale, and Harvard B School, or at mom’s houses in Connecticut and Kennebunkport, anymore than he put his boots on her dining room tables. And JD didn’t use his down home speechifying at Yale LS or with his venture capitalist clients.
It’s called code switching and it can be very important to marginalized communities of color.
https://www.npr.org/sections/codeswitch/2013/04/13/177126294/five-reasons-why-people-code-switch
The question is why Vance is code switching. I get why Harris does it — she’s a member of multiple communities of color as well as cultural subsets and classes. Why is Vance doing it when he’s a member of the dominant political class.
reply to Rayne, re code switching…
I would prefer to think of Vance’s code switch soundalike as craven ventriloquism rather than allowing him and others to co-opt what is, as you point out, a long-established coping mechanism for marginalized people of color. Vance is engaging in nothing more than an exaggerated (per)version of what politicians and other hucksters having been doing forever — read the room and give ’em what they think they want to hear. His lies are more bald-faced and creepier than ever, as befits the political climate, but nothing ain’t new here.
Either way of looking at, though, it stinks.
(not sure I did this reply add-on right…)
Cruz, at least, seems intelligent.
Vance, since his appearance on the national stage as the VP Candidate seems so prone to verbal pratfalls, that he looks stupid. But, maybe, he is just following the Corey Lewandowski media playbook – it doesn’t matter what you say to the media because you don’t owe them the truth, or intelligent responses.
It may be simply that Vance serves well his real constituency – the billionaires – and fakes it with the people of Ohio.
JD Vance is not stupid. He’s very bright, extremely ambitious, and devoid of restraint and normal human feeling. He’s a perfect companion for Donald Trump, whom he fervently expects to succeed in less than four years.
Adding to EoH observations:
Vance also fancies himself to be a serious intellectual with a robust theological core, who has assiduously courted movement conservatives and their think tanks and policy fora. He imagines himself to be an authentic link between the MAGA populism and conservative intellectual rigor.
He ain’t the messiah, he’s a very naughty boy – but a boy who has grandiose dreams
Vance is more desperate than intelligent. The promotion of the cat/dog eating story has probably done the Trup campaign more harm than good. It’s a reflexive lizard brain product, just the same as everything TFG spews (I don’t mean former).
Twaspawarednot
September 18, 2024 at 4:55 pm
There is no doubt that Vance lacks interpersonal social skills, and he doesn’t seem able even to mimic charm, and consequently is prone to making political gaffes. But the strategy, such as it is, to lean into divisive racism surrounding Haitians in Springfield is not of Vance’s devising alone, but seems to be something agreed upon by several figures in the upper echelons of the campaign.
His Twitter manifesto, though disgusting and preposterous to right thinking people, is nevertheless artfully crafted, and is designed to give cover to Republicans who have the self deluding mindset “I’m not a racist but I am concerned about the impact of immigration on our way of life”. Vance has woven together several themes, linking various Republican grievances together. It is a despicable battle plan. But it is a plan
It is a mistake IMHO to underestimate Vance’s cleverness, as it would be to think that his obvious lack of certain political abilities means that he has no political ability whatsoever.
Vance is more desperate than intelligent? Improbable.
You might consider who the audience is for his obvious lies. It’s not most readers of this blog. It’s Trump and the faithful who attend his church, and those who can tolerate only a Republican (at least in name) administration, regardless of who runs it.
Ted Cruz graduated from Princeton, not Haaavaad.
Rafael got his J.D. (not his JD LOL) from Harvard.
Via disinformation researcher Kate Starbird:
https://bsky.app/profile/charliearchy.bsky.social/post/3l4f5mixdi42o
September 17, 2024 at 7:17 PM
Links to:
Russians made video falsely accusing Harris of hit-and-run, Microsoft says
9/17/24
Let me add the threats have also been against two universities (bomb and shooting threats), the Ohio State House (extending the threats to Columbus) and against DeWine and members of his family) and against public spaces and public services. As for the schools and universities, they are all remote for a week and will reassess the threat level to determine safety plans. This. Costs. Money. Money on institutions under financial stressors still from the impact of Covid as well as growth.
GOP are trying to hit hard with anti-immigrant ads here. The timing of some of the new ad drops was oddly aligned with Vance’s first statements and then the frequency increased after the debate.
The goal in my estimation is to make Sherrod Brown lose on the immigration fear button because the boots on the ground that are helping Sherrod are choice voters, which Ohio GOP know has winning numbers in Ohio.
One of the universities has a cyber-security degree with internships in partnership with a firm that works with Wright Patterson Air Force Base. It would be great if this resource aids in tracking country of origin for the threats.
Regarding, “yesterday The New Republic published my analogy between JD’s false claims and those made by trolls pushing Trump in 2016.” I wonder what the online troll traffic is like regarding anti-immigration and border policy after the Vance-Trump smears? Both have cozy ties to social media that would revel in feeding such garbage to the point I could see moderation efforts looking the other way.
Additionally, I mentioned at the end of the previous post on JD’s attack, I know Springfield quite well. Should anyone have questions, I’ll do my best to answer.
One of my neighbors is from Springfield. She is biracial, still has biracial family there, and is terrified, not only for her extended family still in Springfield, but also for her multiracial children who live nowhere near Ohio but want to visit grandma. This is all so deeply fkd up it’s hard to fathom.
Ohio, the heart of it all. I find it ironic Mike DeWine is caught in his own trap between Haiti and GOP hate tactics. The attack on Springfield appears to be coordinated to drive the fear to elect Sherrod’s opponent. I did not realize that the GOP challenger was stumping in Springfield when the Blood Tribe showed up.
I picked up a copy of the Dayton Jewish Observer and as I study the article I have to wonder where the funds come from for this group? Just looking at the picture of this crew screams cash and the timing screams coordination.
I suspect the FBI has its hands full and the local news community is not coordinated enough to track down the threads of this seemingly organized attack; however, I would like to be wrong.
https://daytonjewishobserver.org/2024/08/hate-on-parade-in-springfield/
EW,
As I stressed in a previous post, it appears there is a timeline to this hate op.
I think it is emerging from cowinkydinky to looking coordinated.
According to the Bangor Daily News, one of the organizers sold some land in Maine for $39,000 in October, 2023. So maybe some of that cash was available.
“Because we had the audacity to repeat what residents told us about the problems in their town.”
No, JD. It’s not audacity, it’s mendacity. The slightest bit of due diligence would have shown you and yours that the claims were false.
I thought Vance said he was “making up” stories to get media attention?
If you read that quote carefully, he’s not claiming it’s true. He’s claiming that residents of Springfield said the things he’s repeating. It’s a statement that means “we care about Springfield”. Or maybe, more accurately, “we care about everyone in Springfield that isn’t a Haitian immigrant”.
He’s claiming ‘many people are saying’ as his proof. Donald spent years doing the same crap with Obama’s birth certificate. Only Donald was a lot better at using innuendo and falsehoods back then. Never mind that there are no police reports, many pet owners think of pets as part of the family structure and not property and would have filed a report.
Yale LS taught Vance how to create the impression that he’s saying one thing, while saying another that carries no legal liability.
JD Vance is selling a cornucopia of lies. He’s just unwilling to put his name to them. Not a personality we want one McD’s sandwich away from the Oval Office.
I did a little TL of VANCE’s most recent Senate news releases.
His language evolves from “housing crisis” to
“Haitian migrant crisis” to [post VP selection] “humanitarian crisis”
https://www.emptywheel.net/2024/09/13/the-midway-point-of-kamala-harris-campaign/#comment-1070302
https://bsky.app/profile/reichlinmelnick.bsky.social/post/3l4gksdpnch2o
September 18, 2024 at 8:46 AM
HOWELL posted that a VANCE spokesperson gave this police report to WSJ,
who investigated and found that the cat was safe.
Aaron Rupar:
https://bsky.app/profile/atrupar.bsky.social/post/3l4f2hw7x5w2f
September 17, 2024 at 6:21 PM
So, VANCE gave old info to WSJ, and that’s exactly what they did.
See: https://bsky.app/profile/reichlinmelnick.bsky.social/post/3l4gksdpnch2o
September 18, 2024 at 8:46 AM
J.D. Vance is not just mounting a rhetorical counter-attack there. He’s attacking the people of Springfield, of Ohio, and around the country – by directly and joyfully eliciting the violence of others to promote his political career.
With a single phrase, J.D. Vance illustrates that, if he ever had a soul or a moral center, he parked it as a child with his grandma and never went back to pick it up.
“..if he ever had a soul or a moral center…”
What would Pope John have to say about a Catholic convert who epitomizes the exact opposite of Christ-like values, instead, using Catholic theology to prop up his very strange outlook on other human beings. Can we look forward, in some future time, to Vance writing his “Confessions” a la St. Augustine?
No.
I suspect Pope Francis has the same problem with quite a few American bishops that he has with Vance.
One aspect of Vance’s rhetoric here, is the way he has subtly shifted the premise of the question from “constituents” to “residents”.
He presents himself as the tribune for populist grievances of a downtrodden segment of the population and their right to speak their truth. The sarcastic invitation to “fact check the residents” implies that the leftist media aren’t interested in hearing or understanding let alone presenting those truths.
This is, of course, utterly cynical abuse of his position of power and his responsibilities: he is creating a wedge, is fabricating a human shield for himself, thus manipulating even that segment of the population which he vociferously pretends to be defending.
Doesn’t Vance have a responsibility as Senator to fact check rumors before spreading them?
RitaRita, why do you hate free speech?
/s
And Vance’s behaviour stands in direct contrast with the proper political leadership and civic responsibility that the Springfield City Commission attempted to show at the beginning of this saga:see 9/11 Newlines report
https://newlinesmag.com/spotlight/the-origins-of-trumps-ohio-pets-conspiracy/
FYI.
Most is a repeat of news events but the source is worth noting.
https://www.military.com/daily-news/2024/09/17/neo-nazi-group-led-2-ex-marines-pushed-and-cheered-haitian-pet-eating-claims-gripping-ohio-city.html?
very good report from Springfield by Aymann Ismail this morning on What Next podcast, Mary Harris/Slate.
I don’t believe DeWine about the threats coming from another country. Why didn’t he say what country?
This is the result of a deranged psychopath speaking during a debate. What will happen during November 5th?
This is the Republican Party applying pressure onto the poor of this country. Knock down the poor and keep them poor, for if they get up they may vote for wealth distribution. You have to be a complete fool to be a Republican at this point. Does Lindsey Graham know what’s happening to his happy message of the Republican Party. That it has gone psychotic.
Really? Tell us how you really feel.
That this country was built on slavery and the genocide of the Native American population. That the school I teach at in Philadelphia is in a very impoverished section, basically all immigrants. And that the wealth of this nation is concentrated in a small group of assholes. And that it is about time that this repression ends, that wealth be shared.
All of the messaging from the Republican Party is about destroying government. They attacked the capital. Is that enough for you?
How do I feel? What is your point?
You don’t understand that meme, do you?
https://englishidiomsblog.blogspot.com/2010/10/tell-us-how-you-really-feel.html
I think E of H was being sarcastic and appreciative that you don’t beat about the bush.
Well okay, I didn’t understand? Please forgive me.
I do not beat around the bush. I am working in a very impoverished section of Philadelphia, and I could not be more proud. And that it is primarily immigrant is because we as a nation do this to people. We actually, as a group of weak cowards treat families that come here like we are is criminal. That our housing can go to this point. That basically the Republican Party is a bunch of shill cowards who cannot extend love to these families is criminal.
Oh, perhaps we could throw a bunch of intelligence tests at them, tell them they are below average and not worth the time of day, and make beggars out of them. I am furious. This political system is a sham operation. Malcolm X was right. Slavery was a blip away. Our government is set up to exploit the poor.
Just a stonethrow away from Yass, PA’s richest man and pusher of charter schools. Congrats.
‘We’re drowning here in Springfield. It’s raining cats & dogs’.
I knew their campaign was suddenly in a spot of requiring some kind of new relevance but I thought they’d let this go by now. Except perhaps not having much else to work with, short of the deniable rumours and hearsay of others? I would wager they’re grateful and shocked and surprised for all the free advertising.
Friendly reminder during this period of anger and despair: Do something. Let’s not bitch and despair. Do something today. Do something good.
Statistics show the biggest danger to Trump is a white Republican man exercising his 2A rights.
LMG—Canada? California? Sigh.
DeWine isn’t going to be very helpful here without being more explicit…and, until then, gotta assume it’s just cover for Trump’s local right-wing fascists.
Actually de Wine is not going to be much more explicit than he was on Monday morning. He was entirely straight on the Springfield situation and described the cat and dog meme as simply “garbage”. Given that he then had to avoid direct criticism of Trump and Vance, I actually felt sorry for him. As someone with no actual dog in the fight I thought he did as well as anyone could ask.
I agree to an extent. Then he turned and delivered a “border crisis” barrage. Delivered exactly what Trump wanted.
Don’t feel sorry for DeWine, he’s a pos too.
As is his Ohio Supreme Court Justice son, who was part of the majority which gerrymandered the description/question for the Ohio Ballot Initiative such that the anti-gerrymandering initiative has been deliberately and grossly mischaracterised in order to suppress the vote against Republican gerrymandering.
I don’t watch much beyond clips but what strikes me about Vance is that he always comes arross as hostile and threatening. Trump and he share that ugliness, but Trump adds a healthy dose of vulgarity and greed. Vance just seems to despise people.
It’s really remarkable how patently unlikable he is! How tf did such an asshole manage to get people to give him millions of dollars to invest in bullshit companies like AppHarvest? It boggles the mind.
Imagine how difficult it must be to be his spouse or children.
Usha Vance is no Melania. Where is Usha? At the end of the day, what do she and JD talk about? Educated, an immigrant, the mother of young children — doesn’t she “have some questions” for him?
EDIT: “First Generation” Immigrant. Usha’s family belongs to the Telugu Brahmin community and migrated from Andhra Pradesh, India, in the 1980s.
Any different than the George Conway household with Kellyanne alternate truth insanity?
xyxyxyxy @ 8:37
George divorced Kellyanne in March 2023. How could it be otherwise? Makes me think of James Carville and Mary Matalin in kinder times when Republicans were still civil (they’re still married)
She’s politically conservative, and was an active lawyer until recently.
Despising other people often starts with despising yourself. I suspect that’s Vance’s biggest problem, and he has trouble hiding it. Makes me wonder about his home life and how much his accomplished wife might be hiding.
Or how about where his accomplished wife is hiding.
I think of Vance as Trump-lite.
Bully Buddies.
I haven’t read Elegy (nor do I think he wrote it without significant ghostwriter involvement, like any politician’s memoir). But it’s striking to me how quickly someone from supposedly humble beginnings has adopted a smug, superior outlook that looks down on his own past. I think there’s a lot of that in MAGA–people who want to think they’re superior to their surroundings and deserve to be the ones looking down on others. Growing up in deep red-state OK in the ’90s, the conservative vibe was very much one of being “in” on the secret of how things work and having a stable of “gotcha” arguments sure to, in today’s parlance, own the libs. (They were all based on faulty logic, of course, but it took me into my 20s to recognize it.) Vance very much strikes me as that strain of conservative, the pseudo-intellectual who knows better than you and your arguments to the contrary are just a sign of how much you’ve been brainwashed by liberal academia/media/culture. He just happened to be smart enough (or lucky or cunning) to actually transcend those beginnings enough to inflict this smugness on everyone.
I’ll never forget when Walz had first been announced as Harris’s VP pick, and Vance was stalking them city to city. In the same day, Vance went to chat to the press pool outside Harris’s plane and talked smugly about how he wanted to get a look at the plane that was going to be “his” soon. At nearly the same time, Walz was giving a rally, and stopped it for several minutes to make sure there was medical attention delivered to a rallygoer who needed it. The differences couldn’t have been starker.
“But it’s striking to me how quickly someone from supposedly humble beginnings has adopted a smug, superior outlook that looks down on his own past.”
I’m gonna argue he was like that all along, if “Elegy” was any indication. It’s a shame so many people fell for it.
Quinta Jurecic:
https://bsky.app/profile/qjurecic.bsky.social/post/3l4hjxgeduf2j
September 18, 2024 at 6:03 PM
Links to:
Joint ODNI, FBI, and CISA Statement on Iranian Election Influence Efforts
September 18, 2024
Twofer for the Iranians – giving (or, at least, trying to give ) non-public material from Trump’s campaign to Biden and phishing.
Yes it’s a lie, Yes they use lies, yes it’s harmful, Yes it is scapegoating, Yes we’ve seen it before, Yes it rallies the usual suspects, Yes people will die.
What are you going to do about it? Talk and talk to convince yourself of what is right before your eyes?
I mean, what action are you going to take? Proud Boys already marched – do you understand now?
Sorry, frustrated is me.
Ranting and asking others if they understand what you now understand, as if you’re the only one who does, is not respectful of other commenters. Do you understand? (See how that feels?)
Marcy, good post over at TNR.
Record high stock market! Record high jobs! Record high oil production! Inflation down! Gas prices down! Interest rates down! Crime down! Two assassinations thwarted!
Thank you President Biden and Kamala Harris for Making America Great Again!
What I find it surprising about Trump, after 2-3 assassination attempts, it doesn’t seem to phase him.
He still thinks is cute to stoke political violence and acts like it is a game, no real danger to anybody.
People died already, he acts like he is some sort of hero while hiding behind the Secret Service.
Knowing he is a coward, how is he processing that people hate him so much, they want him dead?
In his bubble everybody praises him, but he must know he is not loved.
In the country, world, there are many, many people that dislike or hate him.
It doesn’t seem to register with him how serious the situation is, he incites violence against his opponents, then when the violence reaches him he blames his opponents.
Given the assassination attempts, he could adjust course and simply stop encouraging violence since this is his doing. Simple solution.
How come he is so sure next time is not ending in tragedy.
No rational person could behave this way.
Interesting article on Vance over at Politico:
https://www.politico.com/news/magazine/2024/09/18/jd-vance-springfield-scapegoating-00179401
The writer tries to (ironically) tie Vance’s scapegoating immigrants to his being a sometime disciple of René Girard, he who had much to say about scapegoating as a mechanism of social cohesion. The article is generally well written, but a bit too twee to my taste (mostly because I’m not a Girard fan; I prefer Genette, who seems more sensible).
The article is twee because it’s focus on Vance’s Giradian phase as described in his essay in The Lamp, https://thelampmagazine.com/blog/how-i-joined-the-resistance
omits Vance’s re-evaluation of Numbers 14:12
“ I felt desperate for a worldview that understood our bad behavior as simultaneously social and individual, structural and moral; that recognized that we are products of our environment; that we have a responsibility to change that environment, but that we are still moral beings with individual duties; one that could speak against rising rates of divorce and addiction, not as sanitized conclusions about their negative social externalities, but with moral outrage…I
remembered one of my least favorite passages from Scripture, Numbers 14:18, in a new light: “The LORD is slow to anger, abounding in love and forgiving sin and rebellion. Yet he does not leave the guilty unpunished; he punishes the children for the sin of the parents to the third and fourth generation.”
And thus he entered his moral authoritarian Augustinian phase he now purports to pursue.
JD seems to over-intellectualize things more than a bit. But the article shows how badly he needs external structure – and an authority figure who commands it – to make sense of his internal chaos.
Trump, otoh, compensates for his internal chaos by making the external world as chaotic as he is, if not more so. It puts him in control, relative to others not able to deal with the chaos – and those who’ve spent a lifetime helping to make the world less chaotic.
Good points all.
And the observation on Vance’s needs, also illuminates the question as to whether Vance is ever authentically stating his own position, or merely posing for effect. The answer is that the question doesn’t matter, because it is whatever he calculates best serves his needs.
“Originating from a foreign country” is wildly unclear to me. Is it just the IP addresses/phone numbers that are outside the US? Because that’s pretty much SOP for internet trolls engaging in SWATting and other forms of harassment (whether the trolls themselves are in the US or not) and doesn’t actually tell us anything about the origin of the threats, or even makes it more likely that they are US-based but masking. Are they talking about coordinated foreign disruption campaigns? If so, why is it a state-level government reporting this and not national law enforcement?
https://bsky.app/profile/emptywheel.bsky.social/post/3l4j7xal23d25
September 19, 2024 at 10:10 AM
Links to:
How JD Vance’s Combative Conservatism Is Shaping Trumpism 2.0 Donald Trump’s running mate has been leaning in on the lessons of ultra-online political rabble rousing.
[I just want to say how pleased I am that “Rabble Rousing” is catching on! :-)]
Re: “Rabble Rousing”, from 2/8/21:
https://www.emptywheel.net/2021/02/03/the-january-6-investigation-remains-in-an-early-stage/#comment-881437 [< harpie comment]
Marcy re: VANCE: how wildly unqualified he is to be President
Yes! Yesterday we got [from NYT]:
111 Former G.O.P. Officials Back Harris, Calling Trump ‘Unfit to Serve’ The signatories of a letter endorsing the Democratic vice president included former members of Congress, defense secretaries, C.I.A. directors and other national security officials. https://www.nytimes.com/2024/09/18/us/politics/republican-officials-harris-endorsement.html Sept. 18, 2024
VANCE is JUST as or even MORE “Unfit to serve”
Here’s the letter: https://static01.nyt.com/newsgraphics/documenttools/38a5a90bef9711ef/a1c00612-full.pdf
There are a LOT of signatures from GHW and W BUSH administrations,
some from REAGAN and TRUMP, and also from Clinton and Obama.
A hero of mine is on the list:
ALBERTO MORA Former General Counsel, U.S. Information Agency, George H.W. Bush Administration; Former General Counsel, Dept. of the Navy, George W. Bush Administration
From Marcy’s Torture Tape Timeline:
https://www.emptywheel.net/portfolio-item/torture-tape-timeline/
JD Vance – his name reads like a vanity plate for a personal injury lawyer – may well be an intellectual. He may imagine he can outplay Barack Obama in eleventy-dimensional chess. But no matter how he oversimplifies his views to sell them to the masses, they are grossly harmful and anti-intellectual.
One of his intellectual forebears is Patrick Buchanan – a blistering racist and strident nativist, in a mid-20th century full of them. It says a lot about how antediluvian his views are about people, race, women, and society. Like Samuel Alito, he’s all for 16th and 17th century ways of dealing with uppity women and native bearers, and thinks holding those views makes him a better Christian. It says a lot about Trump, too, that he chose him as his sub-standard bearer.
https://www.motherjones.com/politics/2024/09/jd-vance-childless-cat-memes-springfield-ohio-haitian-immigrants-nationalism/
I meant to add this analysis from Mother Jones to the post:
https://www.motherjones.com/politics/2024/09/theobros-jd-vance-christian-nationalism/
“JD Vance – his name reads like a vanity plate for a personal injury lawyer – may well be an intellectual.”
You may think he’s an intellectual, but he may only be able to memorize what he reads and hears, which is not, necessarily, a sign of genuine intelligence. Intelligence is accompanied by an ability to apply some general moral element to judgments based on facts. To say he’s intellectual, is to belittle those who work toward understanding the universe while maintaining some order in their emotional and moral selves. Frankly, I am not impressed by liars who make straight A’s in school.
Some immigrations facts about Ohio:
4.9% of the population are immigrants. Interestingly, 11% of that 4.9% are from India.
https://map.americanimmigrationcouncil.org/locations/ohio/
That’s useful contemporary information. But within living memory, Ohio’s culture and economy have more extensive ties to immigrants than those numbers suggest. MSNBC’s Chris Jansing, for example, nee Kapostasy, is a second generation American, whose family emigrated from Hungary and still lives in NE Ohio.
Ohio was a significant beneficiary of the great wave of immigrants, c. 1880-1920, from Central and Eastern Europe and the Mediterranean. Many settled and took manufacturing jobs in the industrial cities on Lake Erie, from Toledo to Cleveland to Ashtabula, and the industrial belt from Cleveland to Youngstown to Pittsburgh. It’s one reason they’re so Democratic, which might be a reason Trump is targeting them.
Back in day when Pat Buchanan, the original mainstream actively fascist practicing GOP
politician was a fixture I used to ask, when did the Irish become white? Now this question may puzzle youngsters who don’t know that the Irish were not considered white till I don’t know, maybe the 50’s. Or Italians ‘white’. LOL. Or Russians. People today have little clue that Russians were never considered white but some impenetrable Asian sort of breed, as one might say. As one move West from Russia less than white attached to Slavs and Serbs and Hungarians etc. up to the Poles, or Pollacks as everyone In Chicago, and Cleveland said, until Solidarity, and so the Polish became white. So it came to pass that even people with names with way to many vowels or consonants became white.
It turns out somebody wrote the book, about old Pat anyway.
https://www.dailyhistory.org/How_the_Irish_Became_White_-_Book_Review
While looking at how Vance intellectualises his politics, and courts the broader Consevative Nationalist Movement to burnish his credentials
I came across this
Sen. J. D. Vance’s address at the VIP Dinner at the National Conservatism Conference in Washington, DC on July 10, 2024. ie 7 weeks before getting the VP candidate gig.
It is wide ranging
But in the section (chapter) on Immigration 06:06 —12:52
From 09:05 to end
He specifically uses Springfield as an exemplar of the deleterious effect of immigration on the population of a town including gems like this (slightly paraphrasing the quotes to convey the gist)
“I heard yesterday that 1/3 of the medical budget is now devoted to giving health benefits to illegal immigrants”…
“The left claim they are not technically illegal immigrants because according to the Biden Administration the only illegal people are those who’s grandparents were born here”
“The situation in Springfield is proof that the Government doesn’t listen to or care about the people they should care about first and foremost, their citizens”
https://youtu.be/yXH1p8_jhc8. (The segments of the speech can be accessed by clicking on the relevant chapter )
*whose
Here’s an article about that conference:
The Authoritarian Plot At the National Conservatism conference,
Republicans mix with racists ranting about “post-white America.” https://nymag.com/intelligencer/article/national-conservative-conference-josh-hawley-j-d-vance.html Sarah Jones July 14, 2024
TRUMP chose VANCE on 7/15/24
https://truthsocial.com/@realDonaldTrump/posts/112792061935980928
Jul 15, 2024, 3:04 PM
VANCE’s speech at that conference was the day after the last News Release on VANCE’s Senate website [from the beginning of a TL I linked to above]:
https://www.emptywheel.net/2024/09/18/jd-vance-makes-light-of-actual-foreign-interference-in-his-state/#comment-1070805
7/9/24 VNR: VANCE questions Jerome POWELL on economic repercussions of immigration, cites Haitian migrant crisis in Springfield, Ohio” [my emphasis] and “the causal role of immigration in the further tightening of the housing market, labor market, and the hindering of American wage growth.”
VANCE CITES 7/8/24 “letter [link] from Springfield city manager, of Springfield, Ohio addressed to the Senate Banking Committee, detailing the city’s housing crisis due to an influx of migrants.”
That letter is to BROWN (D) and SCOTT (R) [cc: VANCE] at Banking Comm. It is a request for federal funds to help with “housing crisis” … NOT a “migrant crisis”
Oops
“7weeks”
Arggggh.
* 5 DAYS !!!
Diolch Harpie!!!
harpie
September 20, 2024 at 11:53 am
As ever you were way ahead of me understanding the full extent to which Vance was laying the groundwork for manufacturing a crisis in Springfield for the purpose of exploiting the division he was actively stoking, as part of his pitch to be an all in Nat Con /MAGA VP choice.
Hearing his words and seeing him speak them brought it home to me. Kudos to you for being across the nitty gritty details, which I had read but not processed properly.
EOH:
Yep. Well aware of the history having lived and studied here in Ohio for 55+ years.
The greatest peak of immigrant waves in Ohio was 1860.
My data for today’s audience was to note if a promise is being stated by Trump for a mass deportation of Haitians to Venezuela, then I hope he is ready to address this threat regarding all immigrant groups in Ohio. It would be an important question considering Vance was the initiator of the hate comments. Having a wife the daughter of immigrants from India, I think the data is vital.
Is Trump attempting to stir democratic voting immigrant histories? Maybe. But the purpose of my data was to refocus that data on Vance.