In Attempting To Claim WaPo Doesn’t Chase Rat-Fucks, WaPo Lies about Chasing Rat-Fucks

I’m the rarity among lefties who supports the decision of Politico, WaPo, and NYT (thus far) to not publish the actual files that a persona suspected to have ties to Iranian hackers sent them. That’s true, partly because I think this hack could be even more dangerous than the one of Hillary. But it’s also true because of the opportunity cost that publishing stolen documents incurs.

I prefer Kamala Harris’ message to remain the affirmative message she’s running on, and to the extent that those outlets are doing reporting like the story further developing the suspected $10 million payment via Egypt to Trump, I’d like them to continue to pursue real reporting, as well.

One of the real impacts of the files Russia hacked in 2016 is that they distracted journalists from harder work, work about what a corrupt man Trump is. Campaign reporters are already distracted too easily by nonsense stuff; they don’t need any further distractions from their day job.

That said, reporters don’t have to publish the actual documents to address something that is clearly newsworthy about the files. As Politico explained, the main thing the persona has sent so far was a draft of the vetting document for JD Vance and Marco Rubio.

A research dossier the campaign had apparently done on Trump’s running mate, Ohio Sen. JD Vance, which was dated Feb. 23, was included in the documents. The documents are authentic, according to two people familiar with them and granted anonymity to describe internal communications. One of the people described the dossier as a preliminary version of Vance’s vetting file.

The research dossier was a 271-page document based on publicly available information about Vance’s past record and statements, with some — such as his past criticisms of Trump — identified in the document as “POTENTIAL VULNERABILITIES.” The person also sent part of a research document about Florida Sen. Marco Rubio, who was also a finalist for the vice presidential nomination.

Note, this mirrors one of the first things Guccifer 2.0 released in 2016: Hillary’s oppo dossier on Trump. So in addition to its use of an AOL account, this persona is adopting another of the Russian persona’s tactics.

Again, I’m cool with outlets sitting on the dossier itself. But the content of it is newsworthy. That’s because after JD Vance’s rocky rollout, both donors and Trump himself are asking whether vetters were surprised by Vance’s misogynist public statements.

Over the past two weeks, Mr. Trump has fielded complaints from donors about his running mate, JD Vance, as news coverage exploring Mr. Vance’s past statements unearthed — and then exhaustively critiqued — remarks including a lament that America was run by “childless cat ladies.”

Mr. Trump dismissed out of hand donors’ suggestions that he replace Mr. Vance on the ticket. But Mr. Trump privately asked his advisers whether they had known about Mr. Vance’s comments about childless women before Mr. Trump chose him.

I’d also like to know if Trump’s vetting team knew of the pictures of JD wearing drag while at Yale, which have become the subject of memes on social media.

Whether the dossier was comprehensive matters (particularly given that a law firm also involved in Trump’s criminal defense completed it). It matters, most of all, because Trump has swapped the mediocre Ivanka as his primary familial advisor for the incompetent Don Jr, and the failson had a key role in picking JD.

So it would be newsworthy to reveal the scope and the thoroughness (or not) of the vetting document.

That said, I think every outlet that is sitting on these documents, particularly if they’re withholding details about any oversights in JD’s vetting document, owes the public an explanation of why they’re adopting a double standard as compared to their poor choices from 2016.

WaPo, which is trying to hunker through controversy about Will Lewis’ possible role in covering up Murdoch’s phone hacking,  tried to do that yesterday. Matt Murray boasted that outlets were taking a breath, and then went on to claim that the vetting document isn’t newsworthy because the six-month old vetting document isn’t, “fresh or new enough.”

“This episode probably reflects that news organizations aren’t going to snap at any hack that comes in and is marked as ‘exclusive’ or ‘inside dope’ and publish it for the sake of publishing,” said Matt Murray, executive editor of The Post. Instead, “all of the news organizations in this case took a deep breath and paused, and thought about who was likely to be leaking the documents, what the motives of the hacker might have been, and whether this was truly newsworthy or not.”

[snip]

“In the end, it didn’t seem fresh or new enough,” Murray said.

WaPo even attempted to address something virtually all discussions about using rat-fucked documents in the context of the suspected Iranian hack do not: the treatment of the Hunter Biden laptop, the most innocent provenance explanation for which is that, after pursuing a laptop from foreigners with ties to Russian intelligence for a year, Rudy Giuliani received just such a laptop out of the blue from a blind computer repairman.

Here’s what WaPo claims about how reserved news organizations were with the hard drives described as the Hunter Biden laptop.

News organizations have been tested since 2016. Wary of (1) hacked materials since then, many proved reluctant to report on the contents of Hunter Biden’s laptop out of concerns that they were the result of a hack. As the conservative press latched on to (2) allegedly incriminating emails found on the computer in the final weeks of the 2020 campaign, more mainstream outlets did not join in a 2016-style frenzy over the material, and Facebook and Twitter limited distribution of a New York Post story about the laptop.

An analysis by The Post nearly two years later confirmed the authenticity of many of the emails on the laptop and found no evidence of a hack. [my annotation]

Note the two reasons alluded to in this passage, both of which show up in Murray’s claimed explanation for sitting on the JD Vance dossier. There were two concerns, according to the WaPo:

  1. Was the laptop “hacked”?
  2. Did the “allegedly incriminating emails” prove what the NYPost claimed they did?

Then, in the next paragraph, WaPo addresses just one of those two issues, whether the hard drive copied from a copy of a laptop, was hacked. WaPo claims, falsely, that the linked story describing the results of Jake Williams and Matt Green’s analysis “found no evidence of a hack.”

For starters, that’s a category error. This is a copy of a copy of a laptop, not the laptop itself. What their analysis attempted to assess was the authenticity of the emails on the laptop — but two different security researchers were only able to do so for a fraction of the emails. This analysis made no attempt to assess whether the stuff on the laptop was packaged up from authentic files (or from a combination of authentic and doctored files). Far more importantly, given details of Hunter’s cloud accounts, it did not assess whether people besides Hunter Biden had access his cloud data (evidence at his gun case described that not just his mistress, Zoe Kestan, accessed his cloud data, but his drug dealers accessed at least his bank account).

But it did find that the copy of a copy of a laptop lacked marks of reliability and did include files placed there by someone other than Hunter Biden.

Most of the data obtained by The Post lacks cryptographic features that would help experts make a reliable determination of authenticity, especially in a case where the original computer and its hard drive are not available for forensic examination. Other factors, such as emails that were only partially downloaded, also stymied the security experts’ efforts to verify content.

[snip]

In their examinations, Green and Williams found evidence that people other than Hunter Biden had accessed the drive and written files to it, both before and after the initial stories in the New York Post and long after the laptop itself had been turned over to the FBI.

[snip]

“From a forensics standpoint, it’s a disaster,” Williams said. (The Post is paying Williams for the professional services he provided. Green declined payment.)

[snip]

Neither expert reported finding evidence that individual emails or other files had been manipulated by hackers, but neither was able to rule out that possibility.

[snip]

Analysis was made significantly more difficult, both experts said, because the data had been handled repeatedly in a manner that deleted logs and other files that forensic experts use to establish a file’s authenticity.

“No evidence of tampering was discovered, but as noted throughout, several key pieces of evidence useful in discovering tampering were not available,” Williams’ reports concluded.

There are several details, disclosed subsequent to the story, that it lacks: It doesn’t talk about the ways the story John Paul Mac Isaac’s attorney told WaPo conflict with the story JPMI would tell in his book (one very significant conflict pertains to the date when JPMI reached out to the FBI). It doesn’t describe that JPMI himself disavowed some of the content on the Jack Maxey hard drive, the one shared with the WaPo. It doesn’t describe that Hunter has sued Garrett Ziegler and Rudy Giuliani for hacking him (the former survived Ziegler’s motion to dismiss; the latter was dismissed pending the end of Rudy’s bankruptcy; as far as I know, Hunter has not yet renewed the suit against Rudy given the imminent dismissal of Rudy’s bankruptcy). It doesn’t describe that in court filings, Abbe Lowell affirmatively claimed that the data on the laptop itself — not the copy! — had been compromised before being shared with the FBI.

Defense counsel has numerous reasons to believe the data had been altered and compromised before investigators obtained the electronic material from Apple Inc. and The Mac Shop, such that the Special Counsel’s claim that the underlying data is “authentic” (id. at 4) and accurately reflects “defendant’s Apple Macbook Pro and [] hard drive” (id. at 2) is mistaken.

Mr. Biden’s counsel told the Special Counsel on May 10, 2024 it agrees not to challenge the authenticity of the electronic data the Special Counsel intends to use with respect to it being what law enforcement received on December 9, 2019 from John Paul Mac Isaac (owner of The Mac Shop), and from Apple on August 29, 2019 and in a follow-up search on July 10, 2020. (Mot. at n.3.) However, Mr. Biden cannot agree this electronic data is “authentic” as to being his data as he used and stored it prior to Mac Issac obtaining it.

WaPo relies on a two year old story that has been significantly preempted to claim that the copy of the copy of the laptop was not hacked. The story never made such a claim, and the claims it has made have been undermined since.

But there’s an even more telling aspect of WaPo’s self-satisfied claim that reporters gave up their rabid addiction for rat-fuckery after 2016. It doesn’t address whether the laptop subsequently became newsworthy.

There’s good reason for that: Because after the election, WaPo did embrace the laptop, even the doctored one they got from Maxey, as part of a years-long campaign of dick pic sniffing. Their lead dick pic sniffers, Matt Viser and Devlin Barrett, even made shit up when disgruntled IRS agents released details that raised questions about the integrity of the original copy. Since then, prosecutors themselves have described that the extraction of the copy of the laptop they received — the one whence all the data that sloppy reporters call “the laptop” came — is 62% bigger, measured in terms of pages, than the laptop itself. There are potentially innocent explanations for why the hard drive purporting to be a copy of the laptop would not match it, but those explanations would conflict with JPMI’s explanations for how he made the copy. And, scandalously, the FBI never made an index of the laptop, and Judge Maryellen Noreika allowed it to be used in the trial against Hunter without ever even assuring that the forensic reports on the extraction of the two devices matched what got certified to her in a court filing.

And WaPo is not alone in its continuing addiction to relying on a copy of a copy of a laptop with such provenance problems. Just yesterday, NYT’s Ken Vogel did a story that relied on the laptop which basically said, Hunter Biden asked the Commerce Department for help on Burisma but it blew him off (unsurprisingly, Vogel also struggles with the court filings on which he bases his news hook). Four years after Vogel’s chum Rudy Giuliani released the laptop, three weeks after Joe Biden dropped out, NYT is still reporting the absence of news in an 8-year old email as news, precisely the kind of attention suck that rat-fuckers seek when they provide stolen documents to people like Vogel.

Again, in my opinion, WaPo is right not to publish the JD Vance dossier, though that’s different than using it to assess whether there were big gaps in the vetting of Trump’s unpopular running mate.

But WaPo is telling fairy tales about whether mainstream outlets gave up their fondness for rat-fuckery.

They did not. For four years, they have been utterly addicted to the rat-fuckery of the laptop, to the exclusion of reporting on all the details that should raise cautions disclosed since then.

And as such, the decision not to embrace this rat-fuckery, however correct it might be, is a double standard.

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73 replies
  1. BRUCE F COLE says:

    The Post’s contrived eschewing of journalistic malpractice aside, that photo of Vance in drag is deliciously informative: his demure, unselfconscious pose (as well as the absence of falsies) projects a level of unperturbed comfort that should give even semiconscious transphobes serious pause — if not outright apoplexy.

    • emptywheel says:

      I hesitate to assume too much abt this drag picture. It’s unclear whether he was dressing ironically, to mock Trans people, or whether he was genuinely enjoying the dress.

      • BRUCE F COLE says:

        I was projecting how transphobes might well perceive his apparent comfort in that “costume.” He isn’t presenting derogatorily, iow. For them, appearances are paramount.

      • koolmoe_19JUL2018_1720h says:

        I assumed it was just a Halloween, or related frat type, thing

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      • Alan_OrbitalMechanic says:

        I might be alone on this but if it is established that he likes or used to like to cross-dress that not on my list of objectionable things about this individual.

      • boatgeek says:

        With the solo cups in the foreground, I just assumed he was drunk as a skunk and wasn’t self-conscious about what he was wearing anymore. Assuming again, I figured this was some kind of cross-dressing frat party and he put in the absolute minimum effort in his costume.

      • Ray Harwick says:

        It just looks like a half-hearted slap at drag. Homosexual transexuals (HSTS) go for an authentic feminine look and blend in very effectively because they are feminine from early childhood. Autogynephiles (AGP) try that, too, but they are thwarted by their decidedly male physical characteristics and rarely have a history of GNC in childhood. They tend to look like Vance’s attempt in many cases. Vance’s look strikes me as what a guy would do in some college hazing event to make his frat brother giggle, something like DJT Jr might do, and flop in the attempt. I majored in child development for the purpose of studying gender non-conforming children, “GNC” (because I was one), and this looks like a college prank or a new drag performer (almost always an ordinary gay, non-trans, guy who doesn’t have the money for wardrobe and makeup). Deer in the headlights, thinking he should have worked on developing an act if he was going to park himself in front of his college classmates. He looks so fish-out-of-water uncomfortable, hiding in the kitchen while the party is roaring in the living room.

        • Tiburon_17AUG2024_2031h says:

          I’m sure you mean well, but the concept of “autogynephilia” has been resoundingly debunked for decades, along with Blanchard’s categories of trans women – based on how attractive he found them!

          Links to peer-reviewed articles on the subject at
          https://juliaserano.blogspot.com/2018/03/autogynephilia-theory-that-ignores_10.html and
          https://juliaserano.com/TSetiology.html

          Discussion of how the theory is now the near-exclusive domain of anti-trans crusaders at https://juliaserano.medium.com/autogynephilia-and-anti-trans-activism-23c0c6ad7e9d and
          https://www.transgendermap.com/issues/psychology/ray-blanchard/ .
          Oh, and Blanchard’s links to white supremacists and other bigots are documented there as well.

          “Despite being rejected by medical organizations and professionals who provide gender affirming care to transgender people, autogynephilia has been repeatedly used as a cudgel against transgender women’s identity by anti-transgender activists since its popularization.
          Blanchard, along with Bailey, were exposed as being members of the neo-eugenics group Human Biodiversity Institute by the Southern Poverty Law Center in 2003.”- https://transdatalibrary.org/person/ray-blanchard/ .

          Blanchard’s work is very popular on Quillette, and fits perfectly with all the other bigoted pseudoscience fascists use to justify their violence.

          As several critiques of Blanchard point out, most cis women would meet the criteria for “autogynephilia” too.

          Sadly, far too many well-meaning cis people, GNC or not, stumble into anti-trans eliminationist quackery by way of Zucker, Blanchard, SEGM, and the like, and certain mainstream publications (NYT, WaPo, Guardian, Atlantic) are all too eager to platform lies and pseudoscience instead of trans people speaking for themselves and the scientific consensus favoring gender affirmation.

          Please stop spreading this harmful nonsense. Trans people have enough problems without allegedly progressive allies promoting the guy the “Whispers” character on Sense8 was based on.

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    • Krisy Gosney says:

      I got this feeling from the pictures too. I’ve been out since the ‘80s. And have been thoroughly drenched in my community for a bit longer. It’s hard to tell the whole context from a picture but when straight guys dress in drag they nearly always put on a comical, boisterous, stereotypical female persona. That’s not what I see in Vance. Maybe Vance was drunk and it was the end of the night and he had run out of steam when the pics were taken. But my feel for it is rather that Vance has/had a comfort in himself with expanding the boundaries of gender appearance and actions. To me, that’s a plus in any person. And it’s not something to be ashamed of. But it could explain some/all of Vance’s adoption of his current look and the aggressiveness of his anti-woman stances. As a shield to hide what he really feels. This is extremely common especially with men.

  2. BobBobCon says:

    Do we know if the Vance opposition research was the “main” thing? The description says it “was included in the documents” and the passive voice always triggers suspicions for me, as if this is something that Politico’s editors were careful to run by attorneys and/or execs. I’m not sure I’ve seen a direct explanation of the scope of what’s been delivered.

    I’m curious if the Vance document has been the focus of stories because it’s the most coherent document – collections of emails are often fragmentary and/or full of references which aren’t clear to outsiders, or cover issues which are significant but hard to explain to lay people.

    I also wonder if this is what the campaign sources are trying to focus attention on. It may be the one piece they’re pretending to be panicked about, or the one piece they’re willing to provide any detail on, and reporters are being herded toward the Vance material instead of other items.

    I agree with the leadoff point of this post that outlets need to be really careful with this material, at any rate. It’s definitely possible there are traps here which could blow up on anyone rushing to publish, and it’s possible the sources who confirmed the veracity of the documents are such shifty people that outlets are worried about relying too much on them. If Stone, hypothetically speaking, is one of the people confirming the authenticity, you might want to tread carefully.

    But I do feel like outlets should talk much more honestly about what their standards and methods for evaluating the documents are.

    • Jack_14AUG2024_1226h says:

      1. New here. Hey!

      2. I agree with you. The phrasing used by Politico, just noting that the J.D. Vance dossier piece was “included” with other documents and communications, leaves a *lot of room* for asking . . . what the hell other communications and documents did “Robert” send you?

      3. My question for the people here is this. Is there any chance the Feds told the WaPo and Politico you *cannot* release the documents and communications, because they were either sensitive national intelligence materials (which Marcy opened my eyes to), or proof of past/ongoing crimes (2020 election, 2024 election, classified document retention/sales, Egyptian bribery, etc.)?

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      • BobBobCon says:

        What’s not clear is if Stone confirmed these documents,but the brevity and lack of detail in Stone’s confirmation of the hack – at least on the record – got my attention. There was none of his frequent combativeness.

        The reporters on that piece – Devlin Barrett and Josh Dawsey did too. If anyone was going to be shading the facts to fit a Trump-friendly narrative, or make some basic blunders, it would be those two.

        I don’t know what happened, but I think it makes sense to treat the initial accounts as potentially misleading and the truth could spin off in several different directions.

  3. rwood0808 says:

    The irony of the trump team wringing their hands over some statements Vance made in the past is beyond the pale. They are, after all, working for the reigning champion of bad statements.

    What I’d like to see the press dig into more is the Peter Theil connection. I’ve seen a lot of speculation as to why Vance was chosen and my own opinion is that Theil had much to do with it. (The other reasons being that one, Vance will do/say anything trump wants and two, he meets trumps narcissist qualifications by having Hollywood credentials via his book/movie. Short version: He has “Good Ratings”) I imagine trumps ego brushes aside any concerns his vetting staff might have. I doubt he even read the file past the first paragraph.

    WaPo may be treading lightly due to being burned in the past, but I would bet on the legal exposure being the cause of that and not any form of journalistic integrity. Their new leadership has shown the world what they are.

    • harpie says:

      Short version: He has “Good Ratings”
      TRUMP also mentioned VANCE’s blue eyes as a big plus.

      Re: the Peter Theil connection, CapitolHunters has really been on top of that.
      Here is his/her latest [on the ThreadReader]:

      https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1816122580614447454.html
      10:45 AM · Jul 24, 2024

      Interesting times in the presidential race when JD Vance is going to be IN PRINT praising the plans of Project 2025 author Kevin Roberts. Vance was installed as an avatar of these antidemocratic forces. Trump’s campaign is beholden to his backers. Keep the focus on them. 1/

      Peter Thiel shows up in the Project 2025 sponsor list, though as usual he tries to keep his name quiet. The “T” icon here is Teneo, started by a Thiel employee and his protegee Josh Hawley – they coyly show only a logo, no name. Leonard Leo now runs it; JD Vance is a member. 2/ [THREAD]

      Everything Trump does is transactional: I give you this; you give me that. His partnerships have slowly crept from the churchgoing wing of the religious right (VP pick Pence in 2016; education policy in 2020) toward Silicon Valley neo-fascist autocrats: hence JD Vance in 2024. 5/

      • harpie says:

        Spelling CORRECTION! it’s THIEL.

        Here’s the next most recent:

        https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1813217018948042794.html
        10:19 AM · Jul 16, 2024

        We now know Trump’s campaign strategy. With JD Vance for VP, it won’t be traditional: Vance, like all Peter Thiel proteges, repels voters. Trump’s only path to win is by using vast sums of money to divide the left, slander Biden and Harris, and suppress the vote. Brace for it. 1/

        All Thiel’s candidates ooze JD’s repellent brew of resentment and entitlement. So let’s review, to prep: Cruz, Hawley, Masters, Vance. Ted Cruz: his Princeton roommate said “We should be afraid” and “I would rather pick someone out of the phone book”. 2/ [THREAD]

  4. Bugboy321 says:

    Thanks for this, Dr. Wheeler. I’ve been having a mean streak of that “making you question reality itself” thing since the “bullet to the ear” was memory-holed.

    But to the point at hand, it’s my belief that it’s no coincidence that it was Vance’s dirty laundry in the mix, if that’s what it really is. There should be no assumptions about its veracity should it ever surface.

  5. trnc2023 says:

    “That’s true, partly because I think this hack could be even more dangerous than the one of Hillary.”

    Of course, that just illustrates further the bad faith in the Hillary email reporting. She had separated work from personal pretty thoroughly, just like she claimed she had and just like you would expect from someone who had conducted herself professionally.

    • timbozone says:

      Nowadays it is almost impossible to completely separate personal and business emails, texts, etc. People try but it’s just not possible at times due to which devices have which credentials, where one finds one’s self relative to local comm capabilities, etc, etc. Yeah, its true that some people have multiple phones and computers to try to keep these things separated…but that’s a rarity in most regular people’s lives, and harder to manage for those of us who might travel all the time for work, etc.

  6. Harry Eagar says:

    It is easy to be virtuous about your journalistic ethics when somebody ‘leaks’ you stuff in the public domain. Let’s see how cautious they are if they get something hot.

  7. Frank Probst says:

    The thing about this story that sticks out to me is what’s NOT happening. The standard Trump playbook is to go on the attack, blame your opponent, and then call everything that comes out of this story Fake News and say something ridiculous like, “Kamala Harris and Crooked Joe Biden ordered the FBI/CIA/NSA/military/etc Deep State to create and leak these FRAUD DOCUMENTS.”

    That isn’t happening here. The “Blame A Black Woman” schtick is a Trump classic, but he isn’t doing it. I think the man is WAY off his usual game, and I’m not sure why. Yes, he was caught flat-footed by the Biden/Harris swap, but this could just as easily been blamed on Biden. This feels like more than that to me. Something isn’t lining up here.

    • Just Some Guy says:

      They’ll start blaming Biden for being “soft on Iran” as the reason they got hacked as soon as Scott Jennings or some other GOP asshole thinks of it.

      Relatedly, today I saw a dumb Fox headline about the “Biden-Harris administration” and Medicare subsidies.

  8. grizebard says:

    Who among the 4th estate even needs a juicy leak that they can “nobly” sit upon? If you ponder for, oh, about a microsecond or two, on the professional, political and personal history of Trump, there’s enough info already out there in the open to enable them to write bible-length screeds. Yet there’s hardly been a peep. Biden got the full works, but the orange creep apparently qualifies for some kind of free pass. And it’s not the noble kind either. The press corps by their effortless pusillanimity are quietly sowing the seeds of their own reputational extinction.

  9. Savage Librarian says:

    Speaking of hypocrisy, JD Vance converted (in 2019?) to Catholicism. So, was that before or after he started hating on childless women? Either way, I wonder what nuns think of him. And do they vote?

  10. ToldainDarkwater says:

    You know, I have a daughter who is a trans woman, and I am here to tell you that one documented incident of cross-dressing does not make you a trans person. Being trans involves a lot more than cross dressing, like for a party. Cross dressing is usually of the form: “I am a man dressing as a woman”. Or “I am a woman dressing as a man”. The friction/conflict is kind of the point.

    Whereas, a trans person is simpler: “I am a woman” or “I am a man”. Never mind what my chromosomes say.

    In the photo, JD is clearly cross-dressing. You can see that he is a man, dressing as a woman. His gender identity is not in question, at least not from this photo. (He could be deeply closeted trans, but there is nothing that suggests that).

    Once, when I was in grad school, I dressed up as the Wicked Witch of the West. This was cross dressing. My male identity had no internal conflict.

    It can be kind of delicious to imagine the confusion among the transphobes that this might generate, I suppose. I am playing for a higher goal: Comfort and acceptance for my own daughter and all the people I’ve met and heard about with a similar situation. They are a blessing to us. I would like us to treat them as such, rather than as a problem which we would like to go away.

    • Krisy Gosney says:

      Toldaindarkwater- it warms my heart to hear about the love you have for your daughter. And good on you for helping people with coming to a place of understanding that ‘trans’ isn’t a catchall word.

      OldTulsaDude- Vance may be embarrassed or not by these photos but a man in women’s clothing is not inherently embarassing. Not not sure if that was what you meant but just thought I’d put that out there.

      • OldTulsaDude says:

        Did not mean it was embarrassing only that the American Taliban wing of the MAGAts would think ig so.

    • Rugger_9 says:

      I commend you for helping your daughter link up with her true inner soul and standing with her.

      Vance OTOH is a shape-shifting opportunist who would say it’s OK for him but no one else. It’s the same attitude that the more politically vocal evangelicals have (looking at you, Falwell) so the picture is more about the personal hypocrisy than the dress itself. After all, it worked for Rudy.

    • timbozone says:

      Transvestites are people who frequently dress as the other gender, sometimes independent of whether they identify as cis- or not. I mention this because this older term for cross-dressing is a term that may be confused with the more modern use of the word “trans”. (I note that those cognizance of this difference often use “trans-” as short for “transgender” for clarity purpose…)

  11. OldTulsaDude says:

    “I’m pretty certain this embarrassing photo of Vance is AI created by Hunter Biden’s laptop” – some or many unnamed Republican spokesperson(s).

  12. FrictionBlistered says:

    Is there any reason to discount the possibility that the hack is a leak from insiders (Republicans or Trumpers) who want to squeeze Vance off the ticket without pushing Trump to do it himself?

    • Rugger_9 says:

      I think the ability to dump Vance is gone, dependent on the ballot inclusion dates. Also, the GOP probably doesn’t have a mechanism contained in the bylaws (given the administrative competence displayed by the campaign so far) so any replacement would get a challenge, and not just from the Ds. Every GOP politico would want to get a shot at the VP slot given how bonkers Convict-1 has been since Harris ascended to the top line.

      So, the GOP appears to be stuck with Convict-1 and Shillbilly and will have to ride that ticket all the way down. There is no way that Convict-1 leaves the ticket since it is the only way he dodges jail. Also, a couple of outlets noted the Venezuela comment so it could very well be that if the Ds win, Convict-1 goes into exile. I’m not so certain that Venezuela takes him in unless Maduro remains in power.

      • boatgeek says:

        I got into an online argument about the Venezuela comments, starting from a position that he was talking about fleeing the country. Taken in context with what’s around it, I came to the conclusion that he’s just lying about crime rates here and saying it’d be safer in Venezuela.

        I agree that there’s no way to force either off the ticket. As you say, Trump isn’t going to leave. Vance might be strongarmed into “resigning” but I can’t see that actually happening in the next week or so and after that they run into ballot access problems.

      • Molly Pitcher says:

        I think it is going to be interesting to consider the Secret Service’s position on Trump scarpering off to Venezuela.

        • P J Evans says:

          I don’t think he can get there with his current aircraft, whichever one it is. At least, not with refueling.

    • Spencer Dawkins says:

      I’m not the GOP by-laws whisperer, but most of the discussion I’ve seen elsewhere conflates Vance removing himself under pressure and Trump or someone else removing Vance, whether Vance is willing to go or not.

      My understanding is that if Vance removes himself before ballots are printed, this is a lot more straightforward than trying to punt him, but in either case (as noted in this thread) the key will be whether you can replace Vance without setting off a firestorm of protests and challenges.

  13. marc sobel says:

    The legacy media is simply following the same ethical practices they have followed since Trump descended on the yellow escalator: If it helps Trump, publish. It it hurts Trump, don’t publish.

    The NYT in particular is following a contemporary adaptation of their motto: All the news that fluffs the Trump.

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