2020 Presidential Debates: Missing ‘The Capital of Latin America’ [UPDATE-1]
[NB: Updates will appear at the bottom of this post. /~Rayne]
I pre-wrote posts for the presidential debates, scheduling them to post a half hour before the event began. Here’s the post I wrote about the now-canceled second debate, on which Trump and his team flip-flopped about his participation.
Here’s a post so emptywheel community members can discuss the second of three presidential debates.
Tonight’s second presidential debate scheduled for 9:00–10:30 p.m. ET . Tonight’s moderator will be Steve Scully of C-SPAN.
The debate — changed to a remote format after Trump’s hospitalization for COVID-19 — was to be held at the Adrienne Arsht Center for the Performing Arts in Miami, Florida. Moving to a remote or virtual debate model removes a key topic of discussion though it’s best for the safety of the candidates.
Miami has two nicknames: the Gateway to the the Americas, and the Capital of Latin America. I wonder how closely Central and South America will be watching the debate because the original location lent itself to discussion of foreign policy in the Americas.
Good luck to Steve Scully on keeping the tangerine hellbeast from running amok as he did during the first debate.
Of course we now know that roughly 26-28 hours after Trump’s participation in the first presidential debate, Trump tweeted that he and his current spouse tested positive for COVID-19.
This is Day 14 after that announcement, and still an unknown number of days since Trump’s positive test was administered. We don’t know how long the gap was between the time the test was administered and when he announced he was positive, let alone if more than one test was taken or the kinds of tests used.
It’s also an unknown number of days since his last negative test because Trump and his minions have steadfastly refused to answer this question. We’ve seen reports indicating Trump was not tested regularly.
We still don’t have any indication who infected him or when. We know Hope Hicks, whose positive test was announced on October 1, traveled with Trump on Friday September 25. RNC’s chair Ronna Romney McDaniel was also with Trump inside the 24 hours before the “Rose Garden Massacre” super spreader event.
An unknown number of people including senators and GOP political figures were infected at that event; as of this past Monday we could account for 34 but there have surely been more who either didn’t tell anyone for various reasons including Trump’s goddamned NDAs, or fear, or asymptomatic status.
We’re no closer to knowing how the super spreader event began.
Trump ultimately canceled this second presidential debate because of his COVID-positive status seven days before this debate, unwilling as he was to participate on a virtual basis.
But just because he canceled doesn’t mean we the people don’t have questions for the candidates.
~ ~ ~
Make sure to add the date of the third and final presidential debate to your calendar — format and location subject to change, of course, if not outright cancellation:
Thursday, October 22, 2020 8:00–9:30 p.m. ET
Location: Curb Event Center at Belmont University, Nashville, Tennessee
Moderator: Kristen Welker, NBC
~ ~ ~
UPDATE-1 — 8:30 P.M. 15-OCT-2020 —
I left this post unchanged while the situation gelled into this evening’s dueling town halls, with Biden on ABC and Trump on NBC.
Since Trump’s appearance on NBC was announced, there’s been a shit storm of outrage across social media platforms. Trump refused to debate on a remote basis, but he’s willing to appear on a network this evening at the same time as Biden?
Fuck that.
Many young people are tuning into ABC on multiple devices and streams to watch Biden’s town hall in order to boost his viewership ratings, knowing of course that Trump is hung up on audience numbers.
After the way in which K-pop fans skewed the reservation numbers for Trump’s Tulsa OK rally back in June, it’ll be interesting to see what youngsters can do this time against a forewarned Team Trump.
Not putting up Trump’s crap here tonight, especially after his rally appearance today in which he implied he authorized the extrajudicial execution of an anti-fascist protester.
Biden is doing well in his town hall – but Stephanopoulos keeps talking over people, though he does let them finish the question.
The NBC thing is better than expected, as Samantha Guthrie isn’t throwing softballs at Trmp. He can’t answer questions, and isn’t snowing her.
Trmp’s performance on NBC:
https://twitter.com/AJASONLENAR/status/1316827384620953602
The NY Times has an uncharacteristically honest assessment —
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/10/15/us/politics/presidential-town-halls.html
Trump is really boxed in by himself and his party. Biden comes across so much better. But NBC really blew it by giving in to Trump and preventing people from seeing both. It’s a historic screwup.
Well folks, it’s now 10:10 pm in California.
Have to say, I’m so sick of Trumpo.
Here’s a choice statement copied from NYDaily News: …”Trump also wouldn’t definitely state if he got tested before his first chaotic debate with Biden last month, only saying “possibly I did, possibly I didn’t.” …
I wouldn’t let this guy park my car.
Please, he’s got to go!
Politico is reporting a ton of anger at NBC and Chuck Todd (!) is publicly disavowing any involvement in the decision.
Fingers are being pointed at Noah Oppenheim, the president of NBC News, for jamming this through. Oppenheim gained notoriety for spiking Ronan Farrow’s story on Harvey Weinstein and covering up for Matt Lauer.
NBC CEO Jeff shell is also on the record endorsing the move. It’s clearly a move someone at the highest levels made consulting only someone at the highest levels of the Trump team, and they clearly forgot the basic rule that everyone who kisses the ring gets a kick in the groin.
LOL shade-thrower Rayne hits the target:
Reminds me of Ming the Merciless in the “Flash Gordon” wedding scene where he says “… for the moment, yes …”
Far more subtle than I usually am, eh? LOL
I like a nice subtle note alongside the fire. Keeps the dopamines running, too.
OT, but important:
https://lawandcrime.com/high-profile/assistant-u-s-attorney-leaves-doj-after-36-years-due-to-lap-dog-bill-barrs-slavish-obedience-to-donald-trumps-will/
Philip Halpern “Assistant U.S. Attorney who worked in the Department of Justice for more than three decades and under “19 different attorneys general and six different presidents” is leaving the department because he’s had enough of Attorney General Bill Barr’s “slavish obedience to Donald Trump’s will.”
Halpern wrote in an op-ed for the San Diego Union-Tribune on Wednesday that Barr is a “well-trained bureaucrat” and a “career bureaucrat” who “seems determined to turn our democracy into an autocracy.”
“I won’t work in Attorney General William Barr’s Justice Department any longer,” Halpern painted a picture of Barr, a person who has “never actually investigated, charged or tried a case,” pulling the strings of the criminal justice system in order to help the 45th president and his allies.
I would have said a “theocratic autocracy”
So after the outage that Twitter suffered? There’s a tweet from Don Winslow stating that after that outage? Twitter reversed it’s policy and is now allowing the NY Post article on Biden. Anyone have anything on this? Thoughts? OH. Found this:
https://www.networkworld.com/article/2172705/twitter-reverses-policy-that-would-allow-blocked-persons-to-follow-user.html
So this is some serious changes on blocking policies. Would the government be able to cause the world wide blackout of Twitter? I mean, …….
sorry, that’s dated 2 days ago. I wasn’t careful enough,. my bad.
That seems like a bad idea if the followed is able to see the person is following them after a block, I’ve read some articles about domestic abuse/stalkers who even after being blocked from direct communication on platform x (google drive was the example) was able to harrass their victim indirectly by changing their display name to something threatening knowing the victim could still see it somewhere (e.g. their list of followers, or requests to access a shared file).
And because the debate mess just wasn’t messy enough:
https://www.cnn.com/2020/10/15/media/steve-scully-cspan-suspended/index.html
If it was a Superbowl game then Scully dropped the ball when the pressure got too much for him.
But this is actually some brutal defrauding which has produced a death toll of over 200,000 Americans so far.
Scully might look to patriotic close colleagues who know him and what he has to offer, and ask them for direction.
Someone help me thru this. 1. Who cares, really, that Scully tweeted Scaramucci? (Trump, obvs, but seriously??) It’s apparent I haven’t followed this tempest in a teapot, so I’m not getting why it’s controversial, other than he Scully felt threatened enough that he *had* to lie about his Twitter acct being hacked. 2. How, on god’s green earth, did Scully think this wouldn’t get out? Why do these clowns think that when they post on ANY social media platform, their communications are private?
/end rant
Same question here. What was so bloody damn offensive about the tweet to Scaramouch in the first place? All it did was ask him to respond to Trump???
It’s hardly a challenge spotting Trump’s lies and evasions, but his answer to the question of whether he took a covid test the day of the debate revealed clearly that he didn’t. He said he couldn’t remember if he did take a test that day, but WAS able to remember “I took a test the day before, and the day before”.
There is a particularly strange feeling that comes over ones self, I think, when attempting to communicate with someone who doesn’t process what you are saying, doesn’t communicate truthfully and lies about everything.
That is Trump. It’s useless to try to communicate with him. Useless.
Can’t believe this man is out in the world representing the USA and we the people.
Let’s hope he can and will be prosecuted for this:
Trump: …”We sent in the US Marshals, took 15 minutes and it was over… They knew who he was, they didn’t want to arrest him and 15 minutes that ended.”
Whoever ordered the marshals to do that should be arrested and tried. It’s murder.
don’t mean to be obtuse, but Trump did say “We”… well, as he always does. Aacckk.
Is it feasible for someone to explore/investigate where all the money went from Trump’s re-election funds and inaugural events?
I’d like to see anyone involved in Trump’s financial frauds locked up.
From wapo: …”Trump has resumed an active campaign schedule, holding his trademark rallies, drawing large and enthusiastic crowds”…
Yep I find it funny also that the campaign was loaded with money and now they are almost broke. Brad Parscale was rumored to have taken a “loan” and it’s not unreasonable to assume others have also. If they really think they are loosing and have no chance of winning then looting, at least by this gang and their leader, would not be unexpected.
The biggest prop at many of Trumps brother rallies is Air Force 1. Not clear whether the campaign reimburses the Fed for this.
YES!!!
The obvious background placement of the plane in photos was bothering me!
Knowing Trump, it was done to puff himself up and make Biden look bad. Unfair advantage.
Hey how about Oprah flying Biden to campaign? Or another nice wealthy Biden/Harris supporter!
I’d love to see Trump debate Winston Peters … deputy Prime Minister of New Zealand!
“Sorry sunshine, wrong place”
Shooting down a covid deniar — well spoken, definitive, knows his facts!
Trump & the test he can’t remember: Reminds me of George HW Bush being unable to remember where he was when JFK was assassinated.
GOP VOTER SUPPRESSION continues apace:
https://twitter.com/ZoeTillman/status/1316823286760779778
3:28 PM · Oct 15, 2020
Steve Vladeck adds:
https://twitter.com/steve_vladeck/status/1316823824562827264
3:30 PM · Oct 15, 2020
And Vladeck is correct…wow!
Moore’s DISSENT is MUCH longer than the opinion…and she’s does NOT hold back.
Someone did a study, and 80% of the time, the GOP-T judges rule against voters.
https://twitter.com/jamisonfoser/status/1317143396553687040
Foser’s tweet:
12:40 PM · Oct 16, 2020
Foser links to a tweet of his from last NOVEMBER which has a great chart illustrating this problem:
https://twitter.com/jamisonfoser/status/1197237489657737216
2:37 PM · Nov 20, 2019
Yes, PJ. It was interesting that came out yesterday soon after this Tennessee case hit my radar. I saw this thread by Charlie Savage, which links to his NYT article about the study you mention.
https://twitter.com/charlie_savage/status/1317142039801245703
12:35 PM · Oct 16, 2020
Links to:
G.O.P.-Appointed Judges Threaten Democracy, Liberals Seeking Court Expansion Say
A new study found a partisan pattern in rulings that could make it easier or harder to vote, fueling a debate among Democrats over court packing.
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/10/16/us/politics/court-packing-judges.html
Charlie Savage Oct. 16, 2020
Things that have been argued here since pretty much our opening. Republicans are determined to forge judicial policy, Democrats are stunningly lame and feckless on it.
DiFi thinks that if the Dems take back the Senate, she would, as lead on SJC, would want to go back to adherence to the Blue Slip policy that Pat Leahy sternly used to crimp Obama judicial policy. Designated stupidity.
Feinstein, Schumer, Pelosi
NEED TO MOVE OVER and LET US PROGRESS!
Biden is ALSO too centrist IMO, just like Obama was.
****WE NEED DEEP STRUCTURAL CHANGE.****
I know this all has been discussed here before…I’m sorry for taking up so much space and for SHOUTING…, but
SIRENS are going off in my head and
LIGHTS are blinking RED.
BETTER START SWIMMING OR YOU’LL SINK LIKE A STONE!
https://www.bobdylan.com/songs/times-they-are-changin/
It’s 1968 all over again isn’t it.
Once was enough.
Go Bob!
At least Biden has acknowledged he would be a transitional president — this was a clincher for my 20-something college senior.
I hope the progressives in the Dem congressional caucus get their demand that no corporate execs should be nominated to jobs requiring senate approval. We need seasoned public servants in place who know how to fix the mess Trump’s corrupt corporate cabinet created, especially the trashing underway now that they’ve begun smash-and-grab on the way out the door.
NARAL has called for FEINSTEIN to be pulled from top DEM spot of the SJC because of how she “handled” the C B “hearings”:
https://twitter.com/NARAL/status/1317209478849302534
5:03 PM · Oct 16, 2020
Brian Beutler with an observation:
https://twitter.com/brianbeutler/status/1317200797634088960
4:28 PM · Oct 16, 2020
I wanted her to retire last time she was up – I voted for someone else in the primary. She’s forgotten who put her in that catbird seat, and why.
California is lovely this time of year.
Except, of course, for the fires…
Better after New Year’s, when it should go green – if we get rain.
From NYT:
Here’s a link to Litmans article:
The Election Is Already Under Way in America’s Courts
And the two parties—and the judges they have appointed—are on completely divergent legal paths.
https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2020/09/election-litigation/616439/
SEPTEMBER 23, 2020 Leah Litman [Assistant professor of law at the University of Michigan]
Leah is great, and I heartily recommend her as a follow in today’s world. Used to be at UCI with Dean Erwin Chemerisnky, before moving back to Michigan (and Erwin moving to Berkeley to head Boalt Hall).
From Litman’s article [I added the numbers]:
To all of your latest comments…..YES.
THANK YOU, bmaz!
Here are links to the STUDY page:
https://www.takebackthecourt.today/antidemocracy-scorecard
…and the CHART:
[The case from Tennessee is still marked as pending]
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1S-s6aGkhZtslNzc4F0IeWHjxxzEfpygwvSzc8opr7dg/edit#gid=1677405143
In my opinion, IF Biden/Harris win, and
IF WE expand The Supreme Court, then
the COURT WILL HAVE BEEN UNPACKED.
This is a REALLY GOOD read:
What to Do About GOP Bad Faith After Trump
https://crooked.com/articles/republicans-bad-faith/
Brian Beutler October 16, 2020
Thanks for that.
Another very good read, this one about Barr:
Enabler in Chief
The attorney general exemplifies the growing influence of right-wing Catholicism under Trump.
https://www.nybooks.com/articles/2020/11/05/enabler-in-chief/
Fintan O’Toole November 5, 2020 issue
I watched the Trump event because – well Twitter was saying Savanah Guthrie wasn’t taking any crap – and she wasn’t.
But I couldn’t help but notice the trio of women behind Trump in many of the camera shots of him. The one on his left was bobbing her head up and down most of the time.
Plant much?
Read she was a from the Dominican Republic and 100% a plant.
I read she’s a selfie-collector who ran for congress a few years back. And a Trumpista.
It turns out she’s a Trumpie that ran for Congress in FL, getting 3% of the vote behind the D winner and the GOP challenger.
I was also interested in how DJT screamed “setup” when it was his campaign that strong-armed NBC into pre-empting Chris Hayes. His MAGA base will believe him but no one else does.
OT, CA allows you to check on your ballot status through the Secretary of State’s office, mine is accepted and will be counted.
Mine was verified Tuesday. It’s nice to be able to check. (I used a very-official drop box in front of my local branch library.)
Just a tad off topic — read (again) today about the huge amount of money that goes to Trump’s properties/business every time he or his children travel to his properties…
Trump is starting to make noise about …if Biden wins, Trump just might have to leave the country.
We should be believing him. Perhaps Vance should start prosecuting the individuals who are running The Trump Organization NOW — jump on it — don’t wait. It is an ongoing conspiracy, isn’t it?
I think about George Bush and his staying out of this mess. In photos of Bush, you can see by the expression on his face, he likes people. Recent example, a photo of Bush with the Dalai Lama. For what it’s worth…
From NYTimes —
Opinion
THE SELF-DEALING ADMINISTRATION
BY MICHELLE COTTLE
This article is part of a [NYTimes] Special Sunday Review: End Our National Crisis.
…”The Washington Post has estimated that the U.S. government had paid well over $1 million to the president’s company since he took office in costs associated with the Secret Service. This includes at least 530 nights at Mar-a-Lago and 950 nights at the president’s club in Bedminster, N.J.
Taxpayers are also footing part of the bill for business trips by the Trump kids. In January 2017, Eric Trump jetted down to Uruguay to check on one of the Trump Organization’s condo projects, costing Americans around $98,000 in hotel rooms for the Secret Service and embassy staff members. Two trips the following month, one by Eric to the Dominican Republic and one by Eric and Don Jr. to Dubai, ran taxpayers nearly $250,000 for Secret Service expenses such as airfare, lodging and ground transportation.
In May of 2018, China awarded Mr. Trump’s golden child, Ivanka, seven trademarks for her now-defunct lifestyle brand, right around the same time her father was pledging to save a major Chinese telecommunications company, ZTE, from going belly up. Ivanka’s office said there was no special treatment involved.
What’s good for the Trump family is, apparently, also good for the family of Ms. Trump’s husband, Jared Kushner, and their business interests. In May 2017, Mr. Kushner’s sister played up her brother’s position as senior adviser to the president when pitching some of Kushner Companies’ real estate developments to prospective Chinese investors through a federal program that provides fast-track visas to wealthy foreign investors. The project “means a lot to me and my entire family,” she told them.” …