Seven Days, 250,000 Cars
Seven days ago, the Cash for Clunkers program went into place. At midnight, the program will run out of money, having already supported the trade-in of 250,000 old cars.
The U.S. government will suspend the popular cash-for-clunkers program after less than four days in business, telling Congress that the plan would burn through its $950-million budget by midnight, several sources told the Free Press.
[snip]
A survey of 2,000 dealers by the National Automobile Dealers Association, the results of which were obtained by the Free Press, found about 25,000 deals not yet approved by NHTSA, or about 13 trades per store. With 23,005 dealers asking to be part of the program, auto dealers may have already arranged the sale of more than the 250,000 vehicles that federal officials expected the plan to generate.
Bill Golling, owner of Golling Chrysler-Jeep-Dodge in Bloomfield Hills, said his store had sold 80 vehicles already under the program.
I can’t tell you how much difference 80 vehicle sales would mean for your average car dealer in this climate.
Understand, this was a highly imperfect program. Dealers are now waiting impatiently for their reimbursement from the government. And DiFi is–rightly–demanding that if the program is refunded, it must require a higher MPG improvement for the trade-ins. But for the 110 House Republicans and the all but 4 Senate Republicans who voted against this bill–and for the majority of Republicans poo-pooing the ability of government stimulus to have a positive effect on the economy?
The Party of No doesn’t get to claim credit…
Update: Here’s Crazy Pete Hoekstra admitting he was wrong about the program (though, as a Michigander, he was one of the Republicans who voted for the program).
Kinda makes me wish I had a clunker.
Note, the dealers first got to start applying for the program last week. I think the four days in the article refer to the actual days when dealers could sell the cars.
You know actually it looks like this was live for less than four days.
I was amazed to find out that I had a “clunker” last weekend that conveniently crapped out last week after 9 loyal years. I went to my local dealer and arranged a deal for a new car that will transport me to my new place of employment every day.
The dealers are trying hard to unload inventory, but I suspect it is not quite enough. Clunkers for Cash, applied appropriately, could help the economy in a big way…
I suspect it’ll be refunded, hopefully with much better restrictions on MPG. I think you’d even find Republicans piling on this time around–have I pointed out that car dealers actually give more money to pols than manufacturers?
Are you kidding?! I just talked my husband into turning in our old pickup for a new pickup and I told him the program didn’t end until Nov 1 or whenever funds ran out…I would not have guessed it would be one week!
The local anchor said goddarnit. She can’t compete.
KagroX on MSNBC right now.
Except it’s Richard “Twit” Wolffe again tonight, and I really can’t stand him.
FWDiva
Wolfie was OK. Pretty smooth, actually.
Problem with the cash for clunkers program: What’s actually going to happen to the clunkers? I bet they get sold and are back on the road within a month or so.
Bob in HI
No, the dealers have to disable and junk the cars to get the reimbursement. And there are already stories of backlogs at junkyards.
What’s the point of disabling and destroying the cars? Why not use the parts?
I’m not sure how they’re required to disable the engine, but that’s what happens–it’s possible the rest goes to parts.
Here are the guidelines:
at page 39
Beer, motor oil, or ?
A bottle of Karo syrup in the gas tank will do the same thing. Run at a medium speed the engine should freeze up in about 20 minutes. Saves getting oil under one’s finger nails.
I am just surprised there was not a no bid contract to KBR or Blackwater/Xe to shoot the drivetrains with 50 caliber machine guns or something.
With DU ammo.
That’ll be one of the things the Republicans request for the re-funded program, no doubt.
Hey, thanks for the first real laugh of the evening.
I’ve heard that a 9mm mercury-filled hollow-point will do the job quite nicely. Cracks open the block.
Replacing the motor oil with sodium silicate and running it is what I’ve read to be NHTSA’s recommended procedure, followed by crushing or shredding the vehicles at approved facilties.
You’re right.
I’m watching the repeat based on your comments, and it’s been surprisingly good. Especially calling out Karl Rove over the politics of fear.
OT, but please go read LaFiga’s post about her friend Edith’s battle with breast cancer and the financial ruin that resulted–and she was ensured! Hugely powerful, and tragically sad.
FWDiva
Edith’s story’s gotta go viral, somehow, and into every Congressional office on the Hill.
Lisa just posted a link to her blog. You wanna collaborate on getting that word out? I know Lisa sees her loss as relatively small, but I feel like I should step up and do some legwork on this one.
FWDiva
Yes, there are so many stories, many many are equally tragic, but few as well told as Lisa told Edithe’s.
OTOH, she (Edithe) has family members who might not care to have her name and face disseminated so widely. Before we start emailing, it would be a good idea to get her next of kin’s permission.
I agree. We should jump back to Lisa’s instead of bouncing back and forth.
See you both there.
And, yes, I was concerned about having proper permission from the loved ones.
FWDiva
That was KagroX? cool.
Bob in HI
OT but just watching Mike Stark??? “firedoglake.com” on Countdown! Way cool.
on edit: Kagrox, aka? Sorry.
If Congress has any sense (I know, an oxymoron), they’ll jump in with both feet to re-fund this program as a “stimulus” package.
Considering the tens of billions of taxpayer monies that went into bailing out 1 1/2 of the Big 2 1/2, this is but a rounding error in additional cost.
The positive impact on the entire auto foodchain is pure political benefit.
I agree EW that a better MPG number should be in the next go-around, but not too stringent since there aren’t yet many ultra-high MPG choices.
Our local news had a report from a local dealer (missed who or what brand) saying they were selling 8 to ten!!! cars a day! Considering that they were all failing because they had no sales over weeks, this is amazing.
That Pete Hoekstra bit is amazing – except I notice he goes on to complain about the “paperwork required by the federal government.”
on edit: Oh, so Waldman is KagroX? How kewl! He was great! Didn’t seem wild-eyed at all, wasn’t wearing pj’s…/s
Uhmmmm, yeeeeeah! Bet the guy complains about fraud in other social programs, though.
Look, buddy, paperwork is part of accountability. Though I don’t expect you know what that word means…
FWDiva
7 days 250,000 cars The Stimulus is working tighten up the milage requirement and keep it going!
I wonder how many cars it would take to get GM healthy again? I wonder if extra cash for the Volt would help it is kind of pricey.
Trade in your clunker now and be first in line for a Volt.
I don’t understand the reason for a “higher MPG” in the new program as re-funded. Do we want more people’s cars in the program, or do we want it to last longer next time?
I think we want them to buy high-MPG new cars. But EW is the expert…
Or maybe we want to limit “clunkers” to truly low-MPG models?
I remember there wasn’t universal happiness about how the program was passed in the first place…
FWDiva
On the cars, the program required a pretty big increase in MPG. But for trucks, it didn’t really.
We can’t have more guzzlers on the road.
I think the reason they did what they did was bc Chrysler, for example, wouldn’t necessarily have a truck/SUV/pickup that would qualify.
I was looking at the ‘09 F-150 yesterday. The new one would only get 1 mpg more than the 1997 I have but they would have kicked in $3,400 on it.
Amazing progress — one mile per gallon improvement every twelve years!
The 1997 – 14 mpg, the 2009 – 15 mpg. This is a 4wd. I average 19 mpg because I am almost always on the highway. And with 437,000 miles on the truck that isn’t too shabby.
Than the official MPG, or what you’re getting? I thought F150 had pretty high EPA ratings on their new ones.
The 4WD of anything sucks way more Gas … F-150 4X4 gets 14/18 or 14/19, depending on Engine. This is about 1 mpg less than the 2WD, which is impressive, IMO.
The 14 and 15 were according to the gov’t website.
Agreed that a higher improvement figure needs to be a part of it. SOmething to consider is to make that improvement figure apply across the board, so that if someone has a 21 mpg care and trades it in on a hybrid or other option that gives them an over 20 mpg improvement, they don’t feel excluded. That’s the grouse line I have heard over and over, although I haven’t paid super close attention to the program to know how valid it is or isn’t.
OT – Powow has a fantastic post up on the MCA nad testimony today from Frakt.
http://seminal.firedoglake.com/diary/6822
Really good stuff.
Rachel leading with the Beer Summit, too.
SIGH!
FWDiva
Ummmm…. many cars that people are trading in aren’t exactly “clunkers”…. as originally intended.
In the final watered down legislation, the only qualification to get a new car is that it gets 5 mpg more than the one you’re trading in….
So according to the article in the local paper…. people were trading in gas-hogs for slightly better gas mileage.
So a local Repub who grumbled about it “took the deal that they couldn’t pass up”….
So… remember when people got tax breaks in 2004 for gas guzzling SUVs? They are now trading them in and getting another tax break.
Ain’t it great in America. The tax break is only for new cars… how many people who truly drive “clunkers” can trade in for a new car, even with a $4500 tax break?
Yeah, I drive that boat, mon!
FWDiva
There were stories of people getting new cars for $12,000 or so, with other rebates. That’s still a lot, but people were getting huge bargains.
And how many people who really need a new and more efficient car still have a credit rating good enough to get a car loan? I can’t even imagine what has happened to our collective credit rating over the last few years.
It’s certainly easier to get a loan for $4500 less, though, right?
Really good point.
I’m just glad that money is going more directly to people and not “too big to fail” zombie/vampire banks, though they probably got a piece of the action too.
The program is a pretty big slap in the face for trickle down economics. In a very short period of time, look how many parties benefitted from each transaction.
I never understood why they didn’t decide to do some jobs programs and utilize some of the New Deal ideas.
Maybe now that Obama’s approval numbers are going down so quickly, someone will figure out that we need some programs which affect people directly and quickly. Jobs, jobs, jobs.
We drove by a Chevy dealership a week or so ago and the lot looked entirely different than it used to. The vehicle size of the inventory on the lot was much smaller, on average.
I do hope we’ll see some effect of the stimulus soon here — unemployment was up again this month and it is the highest it’s been in thirty years in this state.
Well, a recent report said about 90% or more of car dealers in America are staunch Republicans. Wonder if these ungrateful bastards are still whining about “stupid Liberals” and how we’re destroying America now?
Would love to keep tabs on them and their various trade associations and what they advocate for in the future. I’m guessing they love Liberalism when it benefits them, but hate it when it helps others. It’s the Repub way after all…GOP=Got Ours, Piss-off.
Chrysler “double your $4500 cash-for-clunker money!” ads still running this evening here on MSNBC
Here too.
Imperfect maybe but damn it’s working pretty good.
As a former Michigander I say do it again this time with 10 or 20 Billion. That’s a drop in the bucket budget wise.
Come on! Let’s go!
Really, let’s do this another five or six times, with a little bigger margin between the trade-in and the new car. Why not? We’ve given the banks trillions with nothing to show for it. Why can’t people get new cars and dealers clear their lots?
Just incredible that the idiots in D.C. can give trillions of our tax dollars to banks and insurance companies as well as foreign central banks, but they have to suspend a 1 billion dollar program that is putting people back to work. Politicians have to be the most pathetic group of fools we have ever elected.
GAH! BeerSummit still…and token black guy saying how badly it’s played for the prez for saying Crowley acted stupidly. God I’m tired of this. It was a bad arrest for god’s sake. Can’t anyone in the lamestream media step up and just say it?
Fork. Forkin’ beer forkin’ forks.
FWDiva
I’m probably going to be tarred and feathered for this, but I’m glad this is dying a quick death. Hopefully, DiFi will lay off on her threats and doesn’t express a desire to see classic muscle cars and pieces of American history thrown into the crusher because they don’t get eleventy bazillion miles to the gallon and run on unicorn farts and rainbows.
Leave the muscle cars alone. Please. Don’t try to shove hybrids or electric cars down our throats, and let us drive in peace.
Hey, you got a muscle car, nobody’s making you trade it in as a “clunker” under the program. Not getting a credit – part of the extra cost of owning a “classic vehicle.”
Well, I for one wouldn’t object to adding on an air-pollution, resource-hogging surcharge to driving such vehicles more than, say, 5K miles a year (IOW, if you’re commuting in one, it should cost ya proportionally).
FWDiva
You may be saying that now, but what about down the road, when Di Fi suddenly-but-not-suprisingly declares war on anything that isn’t hybrid or electric?
I don’t have a muscle car, but I want a 2011 Mustang with the new 5.0 liter V8. If I can’t get one because the Greenpeace alarmists say so, I’m switching my party affiliation from Democrat to Libertarian.
Sounds like that would be a pretty good fit.
So you’d rather offend me because I want to choose my car, not the government or the greenies? Puh-leeze
sheesh out on the interchuckles, the mouthbreathers are now saying it would’ve been much better to give $25billion to this program rather than to GM
now I know how the American natives felt when the White Man first stumbled onto their lands and did all that crazy fucking shit they couldn’t understand
LOL
From Reuters
Mr. Solai manages a GM dealership. They’re selling a ton of cars. They’re also inundated by the paperwork. They even had to go out and buy a scanner for their computers to complete the paperwork. But, no one’s complaining.
On the DiFi beat. Seniors arrested at DiFi’s office. They wanted to talk to her about health care reform. She didn’t want to talk to them.
Way to win the PR war there, DiFi.
May I just say to you all how sorry we Californians are for her?
Hold on… Breaking… Boehner saying this is still more proof that health care reform efforts hurt seniors…
Wow. I DO have a clunker, and was gonna see about trading it in this weekend with this program.
And here I thought I was on the ball, planning to take advantage of it within the first week!
U.S. Won’t Suspend Auto “Clunkers” Program: Official
Filed at 11:03 p.m. ET
http://www.nytimes.com/reuters……html?_r=1
Hey, do y’all think my ‘85 Volkswagen Van qualifies as a clunker??
At least they won’t need to do anything to the engine… at 90 rated HP, it would barely power a lawnmower anyway…
Hey! Keep that van! It’s a historic antique, symbolic of a generation of freedom, although a bit late in that regard.
One of the old trucker’s curses was to get caught behind a VW van full of hippies on a two-lane highway going up a mountain…
That was a worse curse than getting an inside flat on a tandem rig.
Bob in HI
Yes, but since you have to trade up to better mileage, this is what you are eligible to purchase.
Nice ride… but that single seat behind the handlebars looks like a loo
Folks – I need your help. I have a conservative colleague who is insisting and I quote:
It’s a dopey argument, to be sure. I pointed out in rebuttal the 1/4 million low mpg cars off the highway, the 1/4 million new vehicles on the highway, the impact on the dealerships, the impact on the financing industry (because these folks probably needed new loans to make up the difference after the $ 4500). There’s probably more arguments, but I’m running out of ‘em.
What I’m looking for from you lovely folks is: how do I re-but the ‘no big government’ argument with this fool? I’m looking for things like, as a consultant (as I am), he probably has to collect unemployment between gigs because of the nature of the business. What other day-to-day things can I point out he benefits from on a daily business, thanks to ‘big government’?
Police patrols are a socialist enterprise
As are Fire Departments
Food and Drug Administration
Public Health departments (who distributed the polio vaccines back when)
Treasury Department (as in money, since in early years, individual banks would issue their own ‘money’)
That’s just a quick list from the top of the brain
Forgot to add military spending. Is Mr./Ms. Conservative okay with how our government hands out money for the military?
Because we spend more than the next 14 countries combined on military — and yet conservatives traditionally think we don’t spend enough.
What about spending on the VA? How does Mr./Ms. Conservative feel about that? Because it’s a government health care system.
And what about Medicare? ditto, another government health care system.
Or what about Social Security? we all pay taxes for this safety net, are they okay with seniors not having to live in cardboard boxes eating dog food?
What about NASA and NOAA? Could they not see the last several hurricanes coming? if they did, you can remind them we paid for the largest part of technology development which has gone into weather forecasting through these agencies. Heck, farmers are more efficient at crop planning because of these services; are they okay with having enough food to eat?
Jeebus. “Conservative” has become synonymous with “moron.”
Let’s try to get something straight; the program was ridiculous to start with. There is no benefit to anyone but the dealer selling the car. The old car had no specific requirement to be a clunker, so trade in anything. The dealer doesn’t care. How many of the cars turned in were in working order? How many needed minor repairs to be functional, and not cause a huge amount of production cost in carbon, pollution, and waste?
If the gubment wanted to do something, why not help the auto repair guys that are far more numerous than the dealers, and help everyone repair their existing cars to be less polluting, make 50 times the effective vehicles covered under the program, and help both citizens and workers. No, they gave the money to the lowest form of human garbage. Car dealers. Only real estate salespeople lie more. They just don’t have the style that a car dealer has selling that bright shiny little pimple on their butt.
the only people that benefitted are those that could get financing for a car. Do you understand? NO ONE that needs the money got it.
Where in the hell are our priorities?