Mukasey Flip Flops on Pixie Dust

Back during Michael Mukasey’s confirmation hearings, Sheldon Whitehouse got Michael Mukasey to commit that, when a President changes an executive order, he appropriately should actually change the executive order–so schmoes like you and I can know what the President is actually doing.

2. Do you believe that the President may act contrary to a valid executive order? In the event he does, need he amend the executive order or provide any notice that he is acting contrary to the executive order?

ANSWER: Executive orders reflect the directives of the President. Should an executive order apply to the President and he determines that the order should be modified, the appropriate course would be for him to issue a new order or to amend the prior order.

A few months later, we learned why Whitehouse had asked Mukasey the question–because Bush was claiming that he didn’t need to change his own executive orders, specifically EO 12333–which Americans would have believed protected them against wiretapping when they were overseas.

Let’s start with number one. Bear in mind that the so-called Protect America Act that was stampeded through this great body in August provides no – zero – statutory protections for Americans traveling abroad from government wiretapping. None if you’re a businesswoman traveling on business overseas, none if you’re a father taking the kids to the Caribbean, none if you’re visiting uncles or aunts in Italy or Ireland, none even if you’re a soldier in the uniform of the United States posted overseas. The Bush Administration provided in that hastily-passed law no statutory restrictions on their ability to wiretap you at will, to tap your cell phone, your e-mail, whatever.

The only restriction is an executive order called 12333, which limits executive branch surveillance to Americans who the Attorney General determines to be agents of a foreign power. That’s what the executive order says.

But what does this administration say about executive orders?

An executive order cannot limit a President. There is no constitutional requirement for a President to issue a new executive order whenever he wishes to depart from the terms of a previous executive order. Rather than violate an executive order, the President has instead modified or waived it.

"Whenever (the President) wishes to depart from the terms of a previous executive order," he may do so because "an executive order cannot limit a President." And he doesn’t have to change the executive order, or give notice that he’s violating it, because by "depart(ing) from the executive order," the President "has instead modified or waived it."

So unless Congress acts, here is what legally prevents this President from wiretapping Americans traveling abroad at will: nothing. Nothing.

To Whitehouse’s credit, the sole improvement in today’s FISA bill–among a bunch of gifts to the unitary executive and total surveillance society–codified the part of EO 12333 that had ensured that Americans traveling abroad would not be wiretapped, so Bush couldn’t just make it disappear without telling us.

But still, Mukasey said he thought the President should change an EO when he wanted to ignore it. Yet–after we learned subsequently that Bush wasn’t doing that, that he had changed at least one executive order without telling us (and by golly, would you believe it’s an executive order that pertains to our civil liberties?)–all of a sudden Michael Mukasey is defending the Executive Privilege to Pixie Dust.

Whitehouse: Attorney General, I’d like to talk with you a little about Executive Orders. Executive Orders often govern particularly serious matters. In my role on the Intelligence and Judiciary Committees, I’ve been exposed to 12333, which is the one that purported to protect Americans when they traveled overseas from being wiretapped by their government. That one is about to be overtaken by the FISA bill whose vote begins very shortly. Another one is 13440–which is the executive order that is intended to establish minimum standards for the appropriate treatment of alien detainees consistent with the Geneva Conventions. This executive order has been criticized by JAG for all branches of the armed services, but it is the executive order on which the Administration reliesin indicating that it has "clear rules" is the Administration’s phrase for detainee treatment and interrogations that must be done with "safeguards under US law" which I view is in part about this executive order. Now, you and I have had exchanges about EOs in your nomination, I indicated, you indicated, should an executive order apply to President and he determines it should be modified, the appropriate course would be to issue a new order, or amend the prior order. And I think that is an accurate statement–I happen to agree with that. What concerns me, to take us back to our favorite place, OLC again, is that during my review of the OLC opinions I came across the following … opinion of the Department of Justice by OLC.

An executive order cannot limit a President. There is no constitutional requirement for a President to issue a new executive order whenever he wishes to depart from the terms of a previous executive order. Rather than violate an executive order, the President has instead modified or waived it.

Is that rule still in force? And if that is the case, can President disregard executive order 13440 regarding the treatment of detainees, without amendment of information to Congress or the American people?

Mukasey: I think it’s important, or at least useful, to analyze what the nature is of an executive order. An executive order is a direction by the President that the Executive conduct itself in a certain way. The President is free to change that order on his view of how the Executive should behave.

Whitehouse: Any time he wants … [overtalk] The question is, can he leave an executive order in place and act in violation or derogation of it without ever going back and changing it just because he’s the President?

Mukasey: It’s not a violation of it, um, it is his order, or an executive order to start with. I can imagine circumstances, in which it would be not only possible, but advisable for a President not to change an EO when he finds out information that directs the government should go in another direction. For example, if an EO directed that a particular country be treated as not violative of certain norms and therefore eligible of certain privileges and he came by classified information that told him otherwise, he would be obligated, it seems to me, to reimpose those restrictions on that country. It would be inadvisable for him to file an amended executive order and put them on notice that he had come into possession of that classified information.

Whitehouse: Ever?

Mukasey: I beg your pardon?

Whitehouse: Ever?

Mukasey: It would be inadvisable …

Whitehouse: I can understand there are timing considerations, something that happened rather suddenly.

Mukasey: If there comes a time when it becomes advisable and possible, then it’s advisable and possible. It may never be possible.

Whitehouse: So, I conclude from your answer that the existence of EO 13440 can give us no assurance that the President is actually complying with it.

Mukasey: I think that the existence of 440–EO 13440–suggests the President is complying with it.

Whitehouse: Suggests, but can give us no assurance.

Mukasey: The President is–having issued an order–is free to issue contrary directions.

Whitehouse: So, the answer to my question is yes. It can give us no assurance that the President is following it.

Mukasey: I think your question suggests a level of uncertainty that, with due respect, is unwarranted in this situation that you mention.

Whitehouse: Well, a lot of things that we were concerned were unwarranted appear to have come true, so, here we are. But I think it’s important to pin it down, because the question of how we treat detainees is significant, and if 1344o doesn’t, in fact, protect us, then it’s important for us to know in Congress–it’s one of the reasons I think the FISA statute is so important is that it repairs the limit of 12333.

I like that bit: "Ever?" "I beg your pardon?" Comedy gold.

What Mukasey’s rather malleable position amounts to, though, is "trust us." He suggests we can read Bush EOs and somehow discern which ones–like EO 12333 governing intelligence activities and EO 13292 governing classification, declassification, and insta-declassification–Bush has decided to ignore modify without telling us. Whereas there are others–specifically 13440, torture, an area that Bush would prefer to avoid further legislation on–for which Mukasey believes we, and the international community, can just assume–because of its very existence!!!!–the President actually follows.

"Suggests." That’s what the rule has become under George Bush, his buddy Mukasey, and their intoxicating Pixie Dust. Those written instructions? It’s enough that they "suggest" what a President will do.

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  1. AZ Matt says:

    I sort of read Mukasey as saying George can do whatever hell he wants to, the Constitution does not apply.

  2. SaltinWound says:

    “To Whitehouse’s credit, the sole improvement in today’s FISA bill–among a bunch of gifts to the unitary executive and total surveillance society–codified the part of EO 12333 that had ensured that Americans traveling abroad would not be wiretapped, so Bush couldn’t just make it disappear without telling us.”

    This seems naive to me. Would there be any consequence to Bush ignoring it?

  3. Tross says:

    Mukasey: I think it’s important, or at least useful, to analyze what the nature is of an executive order. An executive order is a direction by the President that the Executive conduct itself in a certain way. The President is free to change that order on his view of how the Executive should behave

    Mukasey: The President is–having issued an order–is free to issue contrary directions.

    Substitute the word “king” for “president” and it all makes much more sense.

  4. earlofhuntingdon says:

    The President’s power to issue Executive Orders – rules having the force of law that bind executive branch conduct – apparently includes the power to change such orders at will and the freedom to tell no one about it before or after the fact. Got that?

    Hidden law mean no law, no accountability, and no record of administration conduct. A bunch of guys that claim to detest the French certainly admire the rule favored by their pre-Enlightenment king: l’etat, c’est moi.

  5. readerOfTeaLeaves says:

    Well… just for the sake of argument, suppose you had a Preznit who is a poor reader; a restless narcissist with a long-time drinking problem (and rumored history of substance abuse). If such a strange circumstance were ever to occur, this passage might be of special interest:

    …intoxicating Pixie Dust. Those written instructions? It’s enough that they “suggest” what a President will do.

    Poor readers tend to ignore anything in writing.
    If pressed to read, they create dodges.
    If the dodges fail, they get irritable.
    They hate feeling stupid and bored — they especially hate smarty-pants people like EW and commenters and lurkers who like to read (and are pretty damn good at it).

    So what would a resentful narcissist do?
    They’d try to create a device that makes a total mockery of reading.
    And then mock all the people who read documents.

    Pixie Dust is perfect for such an objective.

    In the real world, everyone who can read is ’smart’ and a Preznit who has trouble reading would be ’stoopid’.
    The Preznit would hate that.
    Because nobody likes to look stoopid.
    Especially narcissists.

    So what could a narcissist use to ‘look smarty-pants’ smart…?
    Pixie Dust would do the trick!

    Pixie Dust would make the Preznit look smart — because after Pixie Dusting the documents ONLY HE would know what they mean. The Preznit gets to look smart, while everyone else (even Mukasey and EW) look stoopid.

    Which would make Pixie Dust downright addictive.
    So, ‘clap your hands’ and just hope that one day you, too, can have some Pixie Dust of your very own.

    As for me…
    Time to go see if I can sew on myShadow, once I find where it’s got off to.
    Maybe myShadow will be better at spotting Pixie Dust than Mr. Mukasey seems to be.

    • BayStateLibrul says:

      Your story line can be the forward to Marcy’s new edgy book:

      Lying Sacks of Shit: How Pixie Dust Sold Out America

  6. timbo says:

    “I can assure the Committee that the President may take pains to appear to be complying with his own Executive Orders…but is not obligated to comply with them, nor is he obligated to inform the Committee, nor the public, when he is violating the U.S. Constitution…”

    And what part of a statement like that is not impeachable? When the folks who have sworn oaths to the Constitution no longer take them seriously, what is left? Just a nation of the ruler.

  7. MarieRoget says:

    Well, I got back from tutoring over @ Covenant House several hrs. ago, but apparently it’s Insomniac Theatre time tonight, so thought I’d relay this anecdote. After finishing the practice GED tests, I let the class fool around a little in the computer lab. The kids & I sometimes talk politics & current events, & I started trying to explain what a crappy day it had been in DC, what w/the Mukasey hearing & 4th Amendment gutting party etc. etc. One of the guys who likes to be known as St. Jimmy (not his real name) had the winning line about it all: “Man, I thought my life was out of control…the United States government is more out of control than my life!” Hard to refute St. Jim on a day like yesterday.

    And on that cheerful note I leave to try again to get some sleep. What a wretched day. Reading you all for a couple of hrs. has made it better, though. That, & a big fat donation to the ACLU.

  8. GeorgeSimian says:

    As always, I find it incredible that yesterday’s testimony isn’t in today’s papers. There’s a small article in the WaPo, but even that slants to Mukasey’s argument that he’s cleaning up the DOJ going forward.

    I was staggered and appalled by that testimony yesterday. Mukasey ducked every question, refused to be pinned down by anything he said and basically repeated the Gonzo line of “I don’t know” over and over again. This should be front page news.

  9. der1 says:

    Democrats should see themselves for who they really are when looking in the mirror, but they won’t. Like the “advisers” that seemingly now surround Obama and push him to ignore 91% of the American People, Congress only hears those small voices. Mukasey is Gonzalez’s brother in the way he answers questions: squishy, squirmy, slick, and slimy…at least Addington didn’t hide his contempt.

    Down the tubes we all go. And 45% of the People think McCain, “don’t tell me about my record!”, the old fuck, would make a fine President. F’ck all.

  10. masaccio says:

    Mukasey says that the President can violate laws without consequence. The hypothetical he gives is an executive order finding that a nation is in compliance with certain norms. This process is a standard legislative act, permitting the president to do things if he makes certain findings, things like providing the nation most favored nation status, or providing it with military aid . Later if the president finds out that nation isn’t in compliance with those norms, he doesn’t have to change the finding. In doing so, he violates the law permitting him to act only if certain things are true. But that’s OK in Mukasey’s hypothetical.

    Whitehouse was incredulous, as well he should be.

  11. RAMA says:

    It sort of reminds me of the time I was covering the village board, and a zoning issue came up with a local business. One of the village board members (a friend of the business owner) said he felt village ordinances were “guidelines” that pointed the way but weren’t “cast in stone.” The village attorney and county state’s attorney begged to differ and had to point out that village ordinances are the law, not suggestions.

    That issue was efficiently handled on the local level (the board member decided not to seek reelection), but it looks like the higher we get in government, the less respect there is for what’s a law and what’s a suggestion. The shear lawlessness of the Bush Administration will, I predict, be the subject of shelves of legal analyses for years to come.

  12. wavpeac says:

    “I did not sleep with that woman. If I did there are national security reasons that prevent me from disclosing the truth about this. Now, leave me alone and let me get back to work. I am the president and I can lie under oath if I want to.”

    geeesh. Do you think they have any clue as to how hypocritical they look to most of us?

  13. Mary says:

    The format didn’t allow Whitehouse to keep going on the more important points. Arguably, what Mukasey said about the Executive being able to review EOs at will is correct – they are just directives, not laws or court orders (just like letters from the President to non-Executive branch members are just letters from the President – not judicial warrants).

    Mukasey’s example of how another nation is being treated doesn’t really even make sense (changing aide and import/export restrictions etc. couldn’t be done *privately* in any event) and certainly doesn’t got to the issue of EOs on how AMERICAN CITIZENS will be treated by their government.

    More than that, though, was the follow up on whether or not the President has a duty to advise Congress of the changes in his orders. Even in the example Mukasey gave, as Congress is making budget allocations and reviewing treaties etc. they are entitled to know what the President knows. More importantly, with respect to how American citizens are being treated by 1/3 of the American govt, the other 2/3 of government which exercise oversight, checks and balances have a right to know what is being done by the Executive to American citizens.

    The real answer to Whitehouse’s questions end up being found “at home” and not from a font of a Bush mouthpiece who has no remaining respect for law. The real answer to Whitehouse’s questions is, in a sense, found in Goldsmith’s and Posner’s novel take on international law – with a homeboy application. What “can” Bush do regarding his Executive Orders? Exactly what Congress and the courts will let him do; exactly what he is “big enough” to get away with doing.

    As pathetic and revolting as Mukasey has become, the incredulity should be directed, not at him, but at Congress. To have become, as an institution, something worthy of less respect than the Bush DOJ is an accomplishment of note, if not one of pride.

  14. PJEvans says:

    So Mucky Kasey is saying that if I get, say, a ticket for doing 80 in a 30 mile zone, I can go into court and tell the judge that the speed limit is just a suggestion, and if I decide the conditions will allow it safely, I can drive as fast as I want and it will be legal?

    (I have actually heard people trying that argument out. Twenty years ago. There may even be judges who would buy it; there was one who figured a pregnant woman counted as two people for the purpose of using a car-pool lane.)