Did Condi Speak with Bush about Rove’s So-Called Innocence? Or about the NIE?
I wanted to add one detail to my earlier post about Waxman asking for more materials from Mukasey. They imply that Condi had a conversation with Bush or Cheney about Rove and/or Libby’s so-called innocence.
Waxman’s letter asks for the following:
I am writing now to renew the Committee’s request for the interview reports with President Bush and Vice President Cheney and to request unredacted versions of the interviews with Karl Rove, Scooter Libby, Condoleezza Rice, Scott McClellan, and Cathie Martin. I also request that the Department provide all other responsive documents that were approved for release to the Committee by Mr. Fitzgerald.
[snip]
I therefore urge you to follow Justice Department precedents and provide the records of the FBI interviews with President Bush and Vice President Cheney to the Committee by June 10. I also ask that you provide to the Committee, at the same time, the unredacted interviews with Karl Rove, Scooter Libby, Condoleezza Rice, Scott McClellan, and Cathie Martin, as well as the other responsive records requested by the Committee.
In other words, his letter written specifically in response to Scottie McC’s revelations asks for unredacted copies of Scottie’s interview, but also Rove’s, Libby’s, Condi’s, and Cathie Martin’s interviews. Mind you, Waxman has seen redacted copies of these, but Scottie’s revelations lead him to demand unredacted interview reports.
Waxman tells us what is redacted in Scottie’s interview report.
In his FBI interview, Mr. McClellan told the FBI about discussions he had with the President and the Vice President. These passages, however, were redacted from the copies made available to the Committee.
And he implies that that’s what was redacted from the other interviews, as well.
Similar passages were also redacted from other interviews.
There are no sound reasons for you to withhold the interviews with the President and the Vice President from the Committee or to redact passages like Mr. McClellan’s discussions with the President and the Vice President.
From which we might conclude that those redacted passages in the Rove, Libby, Cathie Martin, and Condi interview reports are, at the very least, about conversations with Bush or Cheney, and possibly, discussions specifically about the exoneration of Rove and Libby.
We know Rove could have testified about this–Scottie McC’s book tells us that Rove told Bush directly that he was "innocent." Similarly, we know that Libby had such conversations with Cheney–in fact, passages describing those conversations appear, totally unredacted, in the grand jury testimony.
I’m not surprised that Cathie Martin had a conversation with (probably) Cheney about the leak. After all, the one email that had been destroyed and was subsequently turned over to prosecutors shows Martin and Jenny Mayfield closely watching for Scottie’s exoneration of Libby. So we know that Mayfield and Martin were following that exoneration.
But Condi? We know almost nothing about Condi’s testimony.
Now I’m just guessing from the context that that testimony might pertain to a conversation between Rice and Bush about which of Bush’s top aides had claimed to be innocent of the leak. Wouldn’t it be interesting if Bush went out of his way to tell Condi that Rove didn’t leak Plame’s name?
Though there is one more possibility.
In one of the pages of Libby’s notes, he records Stephen Hadley passing on Condi’s assurances that the President is comfortable.
The notation appears in a meeting in which Libby, Cheney, and Hadley were discussing their response to Joe Wilson. The meeting included discussions of "Wilson" being declassified, and the NIE not yet being declassified.
And then there’s that "CP" in the margin. Which Libby has been known to use as shorthand for Colin Powell. As well as shorthand for Counterproliferation Department, the part of the CIA in which Plame worked.
We know, from this note, that Condi had a conversation with Bush contemporaneously (well, before the Novak column, though not before the bulk of the leaking). That conversation pertained to precisely those documents that Bush authorized to be leak–or at least the NIE (though remember–supposedly Bush and Cheney and Libby kept their NIE leaking secret from everyone else in the Administration).
You think maybe Waxman wants to know what the content of that conversation between Rice and Bush was, right in the middle of leak week?
See George run?
See Dick Run?
Run Dick and George run!
see none of them run, they have executive priviledge, they are not inclined to provide ANYTHING that does not exonerate them and whether it has merrit or not, they WILL site executive priviledge
AND THEY HAVE EXECUTIVE PRIVILEDGE
so long as congress refuses to enforce their power they have none
they need to jail rove, jail meyers, jail libby, and jail WHOEVER refuses to honor subpeona
PERIOD
Jailing for contempt isn’t going to happen either. See EW’s prior posting including discussions on inherent contempt. To bad these crooks/traitors will not face consequences in the USofA.
They can be impeached after leaving office.
If only. With Pelosi or any likely successor the most that will happen is a “reconciliation” or a Congressional circle jerk while singing gumbuya. In my expert opinion it’ll be the circle jerk.
in that case our constitution is lost and any president becomes a king
true
Marci, do you think all of ‘em are going to need a pardon before king George leaves?
What’s up with Libby’s penmanship?
Was he that busy, or anxiety-driven?
Old crayons,maybe?
You’re just discovering Libby’s handwriting is totally illegible?
I’ve trained myself, sortof, to read it. But it added weeks onto the CIPA process because only Libby could interpret Libby’s notes.
I had an Uncle, who despite his brilliance, thrice failed his medical boards.
In despair, he grabbed the Dean’s arm and shouted, “Why do I keep failing, why ?”
“Well Son, it’s your handwriting,” The Dean surmised, “it’s still legible … and that won’t do.”
Almost
Most people see my sig and assume I’m a doctor.
Most people see mine and ask to speak to my daddy …
Well, most people would literally hire you as a lawyer; so after this repairing democracy gig is over, maybe you can take on hippocratic oafs!
LOL … don’t get punaise started …
I think you’re poaching on Punaise territory.
*g*
BTW, I didn’t get to read the last thread until it was in EPU-land, but I dropped 4 comments in at the end anyway. Good thread!
Bob ini HI
Any psychological implications?
Is Libby left handed?
The lineup has him: Throws right, and is a switch hitter?
Obama is.
So are Bill Clinton and Shrub I think.
I’m offended. Shrub is right-handed lunatic, his dad was a lefty playing first base for the Yale Elite.
http://query.nytimes.com/gst/f…..wanted=all
EW does this bring into account Plame’s team investigating the sale of arms or that just supposition at this point?
Not sure what you’re asking.
We know that one of the reasons Cheney was after CIA (and possible Valerie) is because Pincus had reported CIA people saying DIck and Libby were twisting their arms. In Libby’s conversations with his briefer, the two events seem linked.
So in a sense it may have been a pre-emptive attack on the people who knew the intell was bad to get ensure they’d not reveal that Dick was pushing it.
I also think Cheney had longstanding disagreements with the CIA and that he viewed any entrenched, much less secret, bureaucracy as inherently hostile to his will.
He and his close confidante, Rumsfeld, who as SecDef controlled a large majority of intelligence programs and budgets, set up an alternate intelligence [sic] bureaucracy in the Pentagon, not surprisingly, made up largely from staff without intelligence backgrounds. Cheney also early on demanded access to raw intelligence data, unfiltered – ie, unanalyzed and vetted – by intelligence professionals.
Oh, that’s not what I’m saying. I’m saying I think Cheney thought the people in CIA (remember Valerie was in teh group that couldn’t prove there were WMD) were abotu to leak all the stuff that BushCo suppressed in the NIE and SOTU and so forth. It was sort of a cause and effect which exacerbated their touchiness and willingness to go nuclear.
I agree with your point. I see Cheney viewing it as a specific threat from a general enemy, the professional bureaucracy. He expected obstruction and reacted accordingly, ruining without hesitation an agent, her network and a model for covert ops. He imagined Bush’s (Cheney’s) re-election hanging in the balance and he was right.
I read some where that the reason plame was outed was they had tracked arms sales to a subsidiary of chaneyburton.
Sibel Edmonds has made some of these claims
http://www.bradblog.com/?p=5685
another article about these claims
http://www.antiwar.com/deliso/?articleid=8091
[P]lame and other employees of Brewster & Jennings, the CIA’s fake energy consulting firm, used to visit the International Atomic Energy Agency [IAEA, located in Vienna] frequently. They used to attend the meetings and undertake deliberate operations to get ‘targeted names’ on their side.
“Plame and other ‘energy consultants’ used to continue with follow-up meetings for those persons whom they had contacted in Vienna, in Istanbul. … Plame met with foreign dignitaries who are in charge of nuclear weapons in their countries and scientists in Turkey, where she has visited several times as an ‘energy consultant.’”
Thanks, thought maybe I might have been dreaming I had read this.
Hadley is conspicuously absent from Waxman’s current list. I assume that means that Waxman has an unredacted copy of Hadley’s FBI interview. That would be very odd, unless Hadley never talked to Bush or Cheney about this stuff.
Well, we KNOW he talked to Cheney about it (this meeting note shows him and Cheney in the same room talking about leaking the NIE). Perhaps they didn’t redact any of that stuff. Though what you’ve just said suggests the Condi think MAY be a conversation abotu exonerating Rove or Libby, as the other ones appear to be.
ANother curious absence on the list: Card’s interview. We know from McC’s book that Card witnessed the conversation where Bush told McC Rove was involvement. Card was waving his arms around trying to get Bush to shut up. Why isn’t he on this list?
How many officials involved with the leak?
http://thinkprogress.org/leak-scandal/
How many times has the Bush administration refused to hand over relevant documents to congress?
Who redacted those notes? The DOJ? What reason could they have to do that in the first place? There is none, except that DOJ is doing the illegal business of the White House. There’s no other possible reason, is there?
Hey guys,
I’ve been keeping up. Busy busy, and looking forward to our State convention down here in Texas – I’m an Obama alt-del so it should be fun.
Here’s what I keep thinking. We know congress isn’t going to get too agressive beofore the election. But there is a spell between the elections and the changing of the guard.
What if the House waits until the day after the elections, then starts impeachment proceedings against Bush and Cheney? Could they be lining things up for such a move? Would that not throw a hell of a monkey wrench in the pardons scenario. So what do you guys think suspend and impeach in late november?
Have we ever figured out why Hadley was so sure that he’d be indicted?
Did Hadley leak to Woodward and Libby?
only slightly off the main topic,
here — it would seem k-k-karl rove
is in some very deep snow, relative
to the long-ago firing of david
iglesias. why? because the guy
who dimed him out was just promoted
to the head of the CRIMINAL division
of the DoJ — effectively no. two,
behind only michael mukasey, himself.
do take a look — it is lots of fun!
Dammit nolo, I hope you’re right about Friedrich …
dammit — i hope i am. too.
this does have the potential
to be a game of “hide the ball,
and run out the clock. . .”
the profiles i’ve read of him,
and his prosecutions — to say
nothing of his testimony re
sen. domenici and rove — would
suggest he is in the mold of fitz.
as ever — we’ll see.
namaste
That’s actually very interesting data. I wonder if they were just hitting the ‘feeling lucky’ button because you’re the first hit on google if you search for Matthew W. Friedrich. Of course, I put in a link to the new page just now because we want the first link to go to your new page (hint, hint).
heh! — cute!
i honestly didn’t realize
that google had mine no. 1
for that goofy search. . .
we’ll have to see, as ever. . .
p e a c e
A bit behind, but just wanted to say great post nolo — well done : )
oh, and take and repost all
those graphics wherever anyone
likes — they are free use!
This Libby note reignites my anger over how these assholes prostituted the classification system. To see this kind of classification on this kind of stuff when I know what the classification is intended to be used for just makes my blood boil. GRRRRRRRRRRRR!!!
you guys realize that when bush found out rove was involved, rove told bush;
“you throw me under the bus I give up cheney and rice”
you do realize that, right?
Perris, are you suggesting Bush wasn’t in the initial planning, with Rove, Cheney, Rice, etc. ?
hmmmm
I am not willing to cede that point so let me amend;
“you throw me under the bus, you, cheney, and rice go with me”
there
Just had a conversation with two friends who are from Afghanistan and studying here in the states. One who will be returning soon, he has been working on his Masters in Communications. The other student is working on his Ph.D in communications and was unable to visit his village in Afghanistan several months ago when he was there visiting. Both said their family members are too afraid that the Taliban (who have regained a great deal of power) will target those who have been studying in the states.
When they return they feel they will have to stay in Kabul and not return to their villages,
Catching up with what is happening in Iraq and Afghanistan since there is very little to no news about Iraq in the mainstream.
http://www.juancole.com/
Sunday, June 01, 2008
Afghanistan: Civilians Caught in the Middle of US & Taliban
Afghanistan has become the Forgotten War on the screens of corporate media. Yet the US has 33,000 troops fighting there and NATO forces amount to 60,000 there altogether. {Sorry for the wrong numbers in the first draft.)
I tried to post this yesterday, but ran into the server upheaval:
We are becoming the enemy we loathe.
George Bush is always talking with especial contempt about the “killers” who kill “innocent civilians”– well, unfortunately, I think that the chief killer of innocent civilians is the U.S.A. Only we try to dismiss those deaths as “collateral damage”, protesting all the while that we didn’t “intend” to kill them.
And to make matters worse, the 60 Minute segment on Sunday showed a new military weapon that can stop people in their tracks 100 yards away without killing them– why haven’t we heard about it on the battlefield yet? Because DOD won’t fully fund the testing. It seems the DOD brass don’t trust a weapon that doesn’t kill.
We are becoming the enemy we loathe.
Shame on us.
Bob in HI
Yeah and in Obama’s speech I heard repeat the Democrats and Republicans theme song “the Iraqi people have to accept responsibility for their own country”. Yeah after we have destroyed their infrastructure, and created an atmosphere of complete disorientation for so many Iraqi people (the ones still alive or not injured.
Americans want “change” and so many others around the world want us to choose “change”. But most of all I would imagine that so many around the world want us to choose to live more simply so that they can SIMPLY LIVE!
I have finally finished the OIG report. The last sections deal with specific allegations of abuse by FBI agents at the major sites. OIG says that only a couple of the allegations are justified.
These reports have to be read in detail, because they are just loaded with Easter Eggs. Among the revelations in those tedious chapters, the Chinese were allowed to interview Uighur detainees at GTMO. Lockheed-Marietta had contract interrogators at one or more sites. Police departments sent interrogators and other personnel to various sites in Iraq, Afghanistan and GTMO. I put several other interesting things up on the Second Working thread.
Using the searchable document provided by Selise, thanks again, I looked at all of the references to Alice Fisher. She has CRS disease. She has no recollection of any discussion of any of the “techniques” (the standard euphemism for torture). She only remembers concerns of the FBI that DoD “techniques” were ineffective. Chertoff CRS either, although he does admit he was told of some of the CIA techniques. He also thinks the major focus was on effectiveness.
An FBI agent told the OIG that Chertoff and Fisher told the agent that CIA had an opinion about techniques. I read this example, from 112-3/438, is just one of several where the OIG is indicating that the agent is more credible than the senior-level witnesses. Of course, this is to be expected.
Chertoff did say he didn’t think much of the “attenuation” idea. 114/438
Chertoff says he didn’t give an advance declination on any techniques. Chertoff was asked to review a draft of the August 1, 2002 Yoo Torture Memo. He doesn’t say whether he reviewed a separate opinion issued the same date, approving the techniques used on Zubaydah, including waterboarding, and something redacted. That little egg is tucked away in footnote 73. This is from 143/438. Fisher confirms this in footnote 43. 113/438
Which police departments, domestic or foreign, and what for. I was aware of the Chinese bit, but were we just basically running torture 7-11s, Piggly Wigglys, Circle Ks, i.e. one stop shops for anyone and everyone to drop in and extract some coerced info?
As to the CRSrs, that is just not credible whatsoever; even less so than freaking AGAG. If I were even tangentially involved in these decisions on torturing people, and how people were to be tortured, it would imprint on me like the decision of a juror to give someone the death penalty. I would remember every detail and it would be so prevalent in my mind it would bother me and keep me awake at night.
What kills me about these people is not just that they tortured, although there is that, but that if they truly believed what they were doing was right, that they don’t have the courage of their convictions and moral decency to stand up and behind their decisions. But, of course, they do not; because they are nothing but small minded common craven criminals.
“But of course, they do not, because they are nothing but small minded common craven criminals” Thanks for saying it straight Bmaz! “Small minded common craven criminals” who seem to get special pleasure in torturing others.
Makes me feel ashamed of my country.
NYPD officers are referenced twice. 263/438, 267/438. There is one from Phoenix. 241/438.
The Uighur interview is at 226/438.
Thanks. In keeping with your work, from the WaPo, we haven’t charged al-Marri with a crime, but we have driven him insane:
sorta O/T at this point,
but also ALL NEW — so,
what-the-hey! i’ll toss
it into the fire, here:
see, those ghosts at DoJ, as of
just moments ago, know that
i know they are looking
at rove, and the iglesias connection.
didja’ get all that?
that’s right — it’s a visit from
the ghost of fitz-mas yet to come!?
n a m a s t é
They leave rather large footprints and smudgy fingerprints, don’t they?
Have some in sitemeter this past week, think they were looking at the fieger content (I’m going back to double-check).
All of which makes one wonder if they need help…
i am hoping that all of this
is like a trail of breadcrumbs.
and that they’ll follow it,
all the way. . . home, now.
do post yours!
p e a c e
Weird. Had several visits from uscourts.gov following the Fieger case.
Only a couple from usdoj.gov for same, seems more random given what what was visited.
But not random from another perspective: all within the same router or switch that visited you, nolo, within the same last octet of network addresses.
And they were on that time for 7 minutes. Must be hand-writing those notes.
now my feelings are hurt.
i thought they were admiring
those graphics — i baked ‘em,
all by myself. . . heh!
yep — this is ALMOST, but
not quite — popcorn-poppin’
fun, tonight!
Schweet ;-))
Poor beggars, though, stuck with WinXP and IE.
(ducking 8))
Mac users are so elitist! And I say so with an Air of contentment.
Heh ;^}
It is nice, however, that more people are buying Macs. More Mac buyers = more Mac stuff for the rest of us. I’d be more than happy to share cool software with DoJ 8^}
Froomkin = really good; he covers the McC/OReilly interview and it’s
http://www.washingtonpost.com/…..01890.html
Meanwhile, LA Times carries the news that Waxman wants more info on the FBI interviews EW references:
http://www.latimes.com/news/na…..5629.story
And at Editor & Publisher, we learn that Terence Hunt, who’s covered the WH since 1981, thinks that McC’s book, ‘isn’t the kind of book we expected him to write‘.
http://www.editorandpublisher……1003811186
bmaz, there are two tidbits in McC’s book that you’d enjoy:
1. He’s a total football fan (Longhorns, it seems) and watched Earl Campbell back in the day. (I kinda recall that name from the NFL)
2. His grandfather wrote a note to GHWB to the effect that Dubya would be good at something, somewhere, sometime, ‘just not at UT Law School’. Does make one wonder why that didn’t tip Scott off to not work for Dubya, but the fact that the little gem shows up in his book is rather interesting.
I remember watching college football back in that day. Campbell and the Longhorns were great. However, a terribly sick Joe Montana ripped their hearts out and won the national championship, as only Joe Montana could do.
Ho boy … football memories deserve a thread of its own, preferably with Beer & Burgers … Campbell, Montana, Plunkett, Marcus Allen, Sweetness … when’s Marcy going in search of Beamish next ? *g*
That Warren Moon at WSU was no slacker either … had an amazing career up here, winning 5 championships in a row …
word.
yeh — and remember — i had
over 20 visits, all before
these — and all in the last
eight or nine days.
my bet?
scottie mcCee’s is lighting
some fires, all over the DoJ.
we’ll see, though. lord knows,
i’ve been too optimistic, before. . .
g’night!
finally — i did get a few from
the SCOTUS — chambers — but, like
yours, i think they were random.
p e a c e
Law clerks are running out of things to do; got time on their hands. By this time of the session, they have done their work and the justices are doing the final opinions.
ding! absolutely right.
it will be fun watching
all of it unfold, now. . .
And totally OT: From the Muckraked blog, there’s this:
In case sojourner or anyone else comes around… you mentioned that you don’t watch teevee. Neither do I very much. I saw all those McClellan interviews online (DSL service).
Don’t miss Jon Stewart and McClellan, part 2 because it does a splendid job of raising themes often covered at EW:
http://www.thedailyshow.com/vi…..llan-pt.-2
Unless you have dialup, your browser should work well.
As Nolo would say, ‘namaste’ and happy viewing.
By the way rOTL, I would like to point out that tonight ASU won a National Championship in women’s softball.
bum volume on that for me. I’ll check at Comedy Central. I did order The Sociopath Next Door, btw. Looks good.
Does that say “Number 2 – it’s better if on leak N.I.E.?” Is it part of Hadley’s report on what Condi said the President said? Does it mean that the President thought that leaking Plame would be better at the same time as the N.I.E.?
With his long war analysis, Bush sounds confident that a fear-prone and eager-to-demonize public, always susceptible to the timely invocation of 9/11, will see the “global war on terror” as the Crusades revisited and done right, with Islam as the mortal and eternal enemy—except when strategic alliances, trade deals, and lucrative contracts are expedient—for decades, as long as the right (to him) people are in office. Maybe they won’t be in office, some of that time anyway.
Bush claims that his war is not against Islam, which he has even called a great religion, but he has done all he can to cultivate the perception that Islam is the enemy. He has depended on that perception to garner and maintain political support, and even for military recruiting.
Somebody should ask all the CRS diseased on the Sept. 2002 torture tour (Goldsmith, Addington, Fisher, and more) what they SAW on that, or any other tour. Take their testimony in private, and compare. Whatever Goldsmith (The Torture Presidency) saw (he does not say what he saw) but whatever he saw made Goldsmith (an old torture hand under Haynes) say, ” this is the reason we have habeas corpus”, i.e. it was so bad that even a calloused creep could be revolted. I say, ask them what they saw, rather than conversations they can or ‘cannot’ recall.
o.k how is this theme for the Obama/Clinton ticket? BE THE CHANGE This is for the “be here now…still here” generation
my theme for the obama hillary ticket is;
“we want to lose and will field the most beatable ticket we can possibly field”
I think that says it all
If Fineman is right (that Clinton will be offered the VP only if she
declines) then this Party is wacko.
However, if Fineman is wrong, then, in my opinion, there IS a conspiracy
against Hill….
We will see, maybe.
I still think we need a woman prez.
I believe there is a conspiracy against hillary;
that conspiracy is among those that don’t want to make a mccain presidency more likely
hillary makes it a dream ticket for the republicans fielding the most hated democrats they can find in one election
I think we still win but I think it’s a mistake to take the chance
But McCain can’t win.
Did you listen to his god-awful speech.
The guy is an anachronism…
If we lose to him, we deserve to lose.
I look forward to that youtube someone’s grinding out right now contrasting the Obama & McBush speeches of last night. There’s a viral in the making…
You may have all ready done so but if not I suggest you spend more time out on the streets, malls, colleges these Obama, Hillary, Edwards (can’t do this now) events talking with people. The masses are sick of the right wing radicals, hell 30% of the Republicans voted for Former Ohio Congressman Ted Strickland (who I am proud to say that I have worked for for years and years) for Governor of Ohio.
If Obama scoops up the Hillary “devotees” merging the Obama vote with Hillary I think that team can roll over the “compassionate psychopathic conservatives”.
I attended quite a few of these Obama events (as an observer) as well as many other candidates events and I tell you the “hope and change” mantra is elevating all kinds of folks…all kinds of folks. If you anchor that movement of “hope and change” with some substance it is sure to win.
*cough* … I’m just a Hockeyless Canadian but as your last two elections have shown, the
weinerwinner is not determined by voters …Does that say "SH:MIL:GT?" As in Stephen Hadley is reporting from the MILitary and George Tenet that "Wilson is declassified" and "We haven’t started to declassify N.I.E."
Close
It says SH M/GT or something like that. But otherwise, yes. There’s an explanation for all this in the grand jury testimony.
So the notes now read:
July 10, 2003
Meeting: Vice President Cheney, Stephen Hadley, Scooter Libby:
Stephen Hadley reports from the Military and the C.I.A. Director, George Tenet, that Valerie Plame Wilson, Joseph Wilson’s wife, who works in the C.I.A. Counterproliferation Section has been declassified. We haven’t yet started to declassify the National Intelligence Estimate. Condi Rice has spoken to the President who is comfortable with the plan and says there’s no question it’s better if we leak the National Intelligence Estimate too. Cheney responds that anything less than full and complete disclosure is a serious mistake.
I believe that’s McL for McLaughlin, the DDCI.
What is the last line of the note? It looks like SH: responds to Cheney’s remark.
OT- Heather Wilson (of inappropriate USA phone calling fame) went down last night, losing the NM GOP primary for Pete Domenici’s seat to Steve Pearce. Wilson was Domenici’s hand picked successor. Pearce is a longtime friend of David Iglesias. There’s perhaps a conclusion to be drawn in there somewhere.
i should think so.
thanks for this tidbit — i
had completely missed it — may
write on it later.
thanks!
The movie-to-be about the Plame outing might be a whole lot better if Waxman’s efforts roust out new information.
Another OT: Yesterday in the Senate, ICE was taken to task for its exploitation of a loophole in government regulations.
No, not that ICE; that ICE, the InterContinental Exchange, a commodity trading bourse in Atlanta.
The original loophole in question, once known as the Enron loophole, has now popped a bud known as the London-Dubai loophole, on account of the use that foreign traders, with the assistance of the CFTC, are making of it to backdoor action in oil futures without normal U.S. supervision. It was opened by none other than Phil Gramm in that CFTC bill he snuck through in 2000.
Leonard at Salon has more of a summary. The Senate hearing page is here.
OT – glenn fine up now (opening statement) to testify in today’s hearing before the House Committee on Foreign Affairs.
live webcast is on committee webpage. and i think this is the direct realplayer link (fingers crossed)
Thanks. We’ve got a sociopath sitting next to Delahunt…
Who the fuck is that Republican from California and why is he so
strange?
i’ve been mostly listening only and not watching (working on something else with the audio on in the background). but i *think* it was rohrabacher.
It’s Rohrabacher, equally stubborn as Issa is in his broken record ignorance on Gitmo & interrogation. As Al Franken used to say on AAR, he “got the memo.” Easily refuted by Glenn Fine, so he keeps trying to cut Fine off.
Have to drive in to the office now. Selise, hope you can rip this or get transcript up for the hearing later today. Many thanks for all the work you do on these hearings, & all else.
am ripping an mp3 now. if all has gone well, will post it later today for your ipod (or similar) listening. thanks for letting me know you are interested in it. many times i rip audios for my own listening, but don’t post them unless requested.
Selise I tried to use the link that you provided for the hearing but it did not work. (not sure whether it’s me or the link) How do I get there?
i posted mp3 audio files of yesterday’s house foreign affairs hearing with glenn fine and also tuesday’s senate commerce committee hearing on energy market manipulation with soros and greenburger. there are also links to the committee webstreams.
I think you’re right… calls interrogation merely “college frat
pranks”
Close Gitmo…
Fine was excellent…
*Republican* & *Sociopath* … isn’t that repetitive ?
I wonder how Rice worked with Ashcroft thru the escalation of torture, as in the Qahtani plot the OIG report describes, with DoD as instrumentality, and Principals as a way of dispersing the liability. The nie leak was political old school skullduggery, but I wonder if the torcha regimes were the weight which drove Ashcroft from even wanting to be in WA-DC. Gonzales seemed more supportive of what was to occur early at Gitmo, so that was a anticipable segue following Ashcroft’s timed exit. The enumeration of escalated tortures in the wholly redacted Chertoff memo at p.114=157/438 seems like a turning point in the OIG narrative. Ashcroft and Chertoff clearly opposed torture in this telling.
Ashcroft is a coward…
Concerned but did nothing…
i am not able to watch, but that description could easily be Issa…
“The subject: How to respond to the fact that 16 faulty words about Iraq and Niger ended up in the president’s State of the Union address.”
Fitzgerald in the transcript just posted seems to have an altogether different idea of what is required to declassify something. He seems to be of the view that telling someone to leak a classified document, even if the person advising this is the president, is not tantamount to declassification. There has to be an orderly process where all interested parties are at least informed of the decision to declassify something. It’s baffling that it’s taken as given that president could ever do otherwise.
point
Do not have my earphones enjoying your takes
How many time does McCain utter “My Friends”?
The winner will receive an expense-paid trip to Ronald Reagan’s Library.
Um … isn’t that a prize better suited for the loser ?
The loser gets two trips. Or one, but one-way only.
July 10: Stephen Hadley, Libby, and Cheney meet. They have the following dialogue:
Hadley: Tenet had declassified the Wilson report, but had not yet started to declassify the NIE [the same document that–according to Libby–Cheney had already insta-declassified].
[Hadley says something that Libby doesn’t write down.]
Hadley: Condi says that “The President is comfortable.”
Hadley: No, it’s better if we leak the NIE.
Cheney: Anything less that full and complete disclosure is a serious mistake.
Hadley: I will–I told that to George Tenet.
OT- The Austin Scott Horton will be talking to Jim Lobe on the neocons now.
http://thestressblog.com/
Anybody else having problems with emptywheel’s site? This page is completely jacked up, not rendering any thing except text. FDL seems fine, though.
The much underappreciated tech pros are aware and working on the problem.
Yes
Is this related to their talking with Tenet?
March 25, 2003 — EXECUTIVE ORDER 13292
Sec. 4.3. Special Access Programs. (a) Establishment of special access programs. Unless otherwise authorized by the President, only the Secretaries of State, Defense, and Energy, and the Director of Central Intelligence, or the principal deputy of each, may create a special access program. For special access programs pertaining to intelligence activities (including special activities, but not including military operational, strategic, and tactical programs), or [for] intelligence sources or methods, this function shall be exercised by the Director of Central Intelligence.
The translation of the note comes from a post at Last Hurrah by Emptywheel. Take a look at the rest of that post.
I don’t know if it’s just me but the images for the buttons,the tabs reply don’t often display today and last night. I wonder if it has to do with some of the server adjustments. The graphics load perfectly on every other site so I dunno.
These are great threads and after trying to figure out what Clinton thinks she is now doing (psst Bmaz the game is over and she’s not going gracefully to the locker room think Giants have trophy but Patriots won’t get off the field–tell me the rationale for that please) and she’s not ever been under consideration for VP nor will she) I just wanted to update the part of the Siegelman appeal where a motion was filed at the 11th Circuit asking that the appeals of the sentences be dropped.
Link buttons and the rest don’t work for me anymore so url which does work is:
Prosecutors drop appeal of Siegelman and Scrushy sentences
http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/s…..TE=DEFAULT
Pete – Hold your firewater. I believe my bargain was that if what I predicted was not the case within a week from now (so a week from last Saturday), I would stand and take all of your best shots. We are still within that time period, and I still stand behind what I think is going on and the information that I personally base it on. The race is over, she will do what she needs to do for the good of Obama and the party; just give her the air and elbow room to do it. And with that I will end my discussion of these politics on this thread.
Maybe Fine will add inflections in the hearing. Given the pace of officials bailing from the administration, Waxman can complete the redactions by waiting for the books to publish. I continue to think the torcha issue was the wedge that divided the term1 administration, Powell unable to tolerate the implications for ucmj of the neoTortcha policy, Rice hoping for the challenge of State rather than ratifying NSC’s complicity in tocha, and Ashcroft the gossamer protector of righteous individuals policy proponent preferring to change careers rather than do what WHC was asking OLC to do, and the political wing of the WH taking a while to rollout a congress strategy. I could even see the showTrials as the apogee in the strategy for letting the final IG information reach the public at a time of more protean public sentiment, as if somehow the tocha paradigm would be subsumed within more fervid public sentiment, so Bush could pass a baton within his own party. It is less than clear Brownback’s departure will support those dissociated partisan ends. I wonder if Rove is one of the recipients of the courtesy copy of this recent 11c appeal amici brief undersigned by a gagle of former state attorneys general.
You may or may not be right on the effect of Brownback’s sacking; time will clearly tell. But as to the credibility, health and appearance of due process as a whole, it was an incredibly insane and horrid act. In light of the Davis revelations and other obvious inconsistencies and rigging of the process, to blithely take that act against Brownback on the heals of his necessary rulings of fairness, is simply beyond the pale. It has all the looks, appearances and features of one of the most, and maybe the most, hideous manipulations of judicial process I have ever seen in my life.
Olbermann pointed out that Brownback, who is scheduled for retirement or some equivalent, agreed to stay on as long as he was needed to handle the case.
From Text of Libby’s testimony at #103,
”Well, the president had told me to use it and declassified it for me to use with Judith Miller……..”
”…I had talked to Judith Miller about the NIE at the president’s, you know, at, at the president’s approval relayed to me through the vice president”….
So…which was it? Sounds like it was the President who told him, because he stutters and tries to cover the Pres by subsequently saying that it was through the VP.
I’m with you Bmaz. I was terribly torn up by Hillary’s vote for the 2002 war resolution and the Kyl Lieberman amendment, I do think the Clintons exposed some of the holes in the Obama campaigns ”hope and change” machine.
I still think Obama has to take her on as VP to win the vote of blue collar America.
OT-Rizko (sp) verdict in 10 minutes (CNN)